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Hmm...who is more critical to his teams success this year.....

Darelle Revis or Pat White???

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Darrelle Revis skips the start of training camp
Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on August 1, 2010 10:39 AM ET
After months of maneuvering and speculation, Jets cornerback Darrelle Revis has decided to go through with his training camp holdout. 

Jenny Vrentas of the Newark Star-Ledger was first to report that Revis was a no-show for his morning physical and conditioning run on Sunday.  At this point, we would have been surprised if Revis showed for camp.

(The Jets say Revis isn't officially a holdout until 5:30 P.M.  All right, then.)

Recent reports indicated that the Jets and Revis are talking contract again, but Manish Mehta of the New York Daily News reported no new formal offer has been made.  With the team's rookie class now under contract, the front office will focus on Revis.

We suspect this holdout could be a lengthy one, but it makes too much sense for the sides not to reach a contract agreement before the season starts.  Right?

No corner is worth the money he is asking.

I hope the jets feel that way exactly!

Cornerbacks in the NFL are very hit and miss. They have lifespans seemingly shorter than RBs in the league.

Remember how "bad ass" champ bailey was for 2 years? How about Sam Madison? There was even a stretch of games where Giants CB Corey Webster was a bad-ass...all of these guys lasted a very short time at being the game's best and then another guy would be heralded as the best or the most "shut down" corner in the league.

Revis needs to get his ass in camp, because by 2012, he'll be getting burned.

you just explained exactly why he shouldn't just get to camp .. he's playing on a very small contract .. he needs to hold out to get a big paycheck

three years into a 6 year $36 million deal.  poor baby, how can he possibly afford to feed his family?

Yup, and they say by holding out he lost the 20 million guaranteed in the last 2 years of the contract.  I know interceptions don't make a quarterback, but this is who he picked off last year, Delhomme x2 (who didn't pick him off last year) Jamarcus, josh Freeman (tb qb), Ryan Fitzpatrick, and tom brady who was in his second game back from last years injury.

LMAO!!.. You're kidding right. The guy shutdown basically every top WR in the game. He put a hot blanket around Chad Ochocinco for 2 consecutive weeks. The guy is a STUD and deserves to be paid accordingly. He's doing the right thing. The jets promised Pete Kendall and Leon Washington their money and looked what happened. Washington got hurt and the jets promptly shipped him away.

The jets will come to their senses soon enough, because without Revis you can forget about any super bowl and the longer this goes they will lose the PR battle with the fans. Revis will get his money when all is said and done.

Ohh yeah Tepop I guess you missed when he picked off Carson Palmer and Phillip rivers in the playoffs as well.

considering the bengals weren't playing for anything, I don't think you can count the first week.  I wouldn't say he had a very tough schedule this year.  He played a load of shit quarterbacks. buffalo qbx2, Henne x2, tampa bay, jamarcus, jake delhomme, kerry collins, the backup for indy.  Yea, probably tough to shut them tough.

I think MEvi$, as he is now referred to, is the one losing the PR battle with the fans. 

And got toasted by Ted Ginn. ::)

Revis had a good season and is trying to capitalize now before he gets exposed and decreases his performance.  He's under contract for three years.  The Jets have the upper hand, they don't have to do a thing.  His choices are:
- play out your contract and then get paid
- sit out the next three seasons

Let's see how "shut down" he is after being out of the league for 3 years.  Fine by me...

Didn't the Jets pick up a couple of cornerbacks in free agency?  I think the Jets are bracing themselves for the fact that Revis may hold out.  It's not hurting Revis right now, when he starts missing those regular season paydays, we'll see who caves first.

even if he sits out the next three seasons, the jets will still have his rights.

There's something else to consider if he holds out this year.  There's no guarantee that there even will be Football in 2011 when the labor agreement ends.  If you hold out this year or even a large portion of it, you could be out of work for a large part of next year too.

There is a minimum number of games that a player has to play (the number 6 is what's coming to mind, though I'm not sure) in order for that season to count as fulfilled, for purposes of contract negotiations.

So yeah, Revis could simply sit out all of camp, then tell the team that he is available right before Week 1 and maintain that availability for 6(?) games.  Whether or not the team chooses to actually play him would be irrelevant.

Not this year.  In order for Revis to get a year towards FA he needs to show up by Aug 10. 

Revis still holding out.  What a cancer he is.  It has also been pointed out that he held out to get the contract that he is currently holding out on.  He is a piece of shit.

you're hilarious. So he's a piece of shit for trying to secure his future. He saw what happened to his buddy Leon Washington and it's not going to happen to him. The jets are the ones who put themselves in this position. Mike tannenbaum went down on the field after the AFC title game loss to the colts and told Revis he was going to be the highest paid CB. Rex Ryan is the one shooting his mouth off about how Revis is the most dominant defensive player in the league. Revis and his camp are just being quiet, meanwhile Woody Johnson and tannenbaum are in front of every camera trying to do damage control. They can talk all they want. The bottom line is that the jets can't sell their fans or more importantly the players in that locker room that they can win the super bowl without revis. Again, Revis will win the battle when all is said and done.

Sure he is a piece of shit because he held out to get the security of a 6 year deal, now 3 years in, he doesn't think his contract is fair and holds out again.  Honestly, revis is not going to make the jets go from a non super bowl contender to a super bowl contender, he is just a fucking cornerback.  You think if the jets give him a deal that makes him the highest paid cb, and he has an off year where he drops out of the top 3, that he is going to renegotiate to give some money back?  Probably not, which is why he is a hypocritical piece of shit. If you sign a 6 year deal, don't back out 3 years in.

The whole point, I hear, is that he wants to be paid more than Nnamdi Asomugha, who's making over $15 M a year for the Raiders. 

Well, two things on that: 

1 - What corner should make $15 M a year?
2 - Who cares what the Raiders do contractually?  They should be considered the way foreclosures are counted for real estate appraisals.  You only use them if there are no orther comparable sales / transactions.

I think Revis should not be holding out.  He is under contract.  He's hurting his team in the pursuit of more money (Let's not kid ourselves; he's not playing the full season).

The only reason Revis is holding out is so that he can make more money.  After this season, when he takes a nose-dive in stats, he won't be worth all that money, so he's trying to strike while the iron is hot.

Its now or never for Revis, but I wonder if the team should put a clause in there that next season they can renegotiate based on this season's play.

This issue comes up all the time -- and we deal with it here at least twice a year (once after the season, once right before the season).

Is it reasonable for athletes to demand a new contract when they are still playing on the one they signed?

I doubt we'll ever get anywhere... it really seems like everyone has an opinion and  they're sticking to it.

The arguments in a nut shell:

The "play and shut up" argument: You've signed a contract. You're getting paid to play football. Do you job, get a big contract next time. And it's not like players will give back money if they play "below" their worth.

The "pay me" argument: Contracts are not guaranteed in the NFL. If teams don't have to honor the contract, why should the player? Renegotiating is simply part of the game and both sides know it. And, to address the "below their worth" argument, if a player isn't worth the money he's being paid, he gets cut.

The problem is that Revis is not willing to compromise.  Of course 1 mil a year is not enough for him, but there's no way that the Jets should pay him 10 mil a year or give him a lifeftime contract which is what he wants when he has a contract already.  If he would lower his demands to say 6 mil a year for the next 3 years it'd already been done and he'd be in camp.

^^^Yeah, but I think his current contract does call for like $5 M a year, as his rookie contract was for 6 years, $30 Million.  Apparently, the Jets are offering 10 years, $120 Million, and he wants 10 years, $160 million.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/2010/08/11/2010-08-11_40m_gap_guarantees_big_trouble.html

Don't get me wrong, folks.  A guy that is severely underpaid should try to get his salary increased.  I just don't agree with the holdout premise, in most cases.

But he is only scheduled to make $1M this season based on what I have read. The money still hasn't kicked in for Revis (isn't it odd that we consider making $1M not having your money kick in yet).

^^^ Actually I would assume it's the reverse, that most of that $30 million was a signing bonus and he's already gotten it.  His salary for this year is just 1 million and will probably go up another 2 or 3 million over the next couple of years.

^^^I read that he was scheduled to receive $20M over the next two years, guranteed, but he is losing out on that based on this holdout. I assume that was included in the $30M total contract so there was a little in the front but the bulk was in the back.

Well if that's true why would he hold out?  He's due $20 million over the next couple of years and he has a problem with that?  He thinks he's going to get a BETTER deal than that over the next 2 years?  No wonder the Jets are giving him the cold shoulder.

Ok, just read the article and it says it's $21 million over the last 3 years of his contract with $20 million guaranteed.  That's $7 million a year.  He wants around $16 million a year which is just ridiculous.  The Jets say they are willing to make it around $10 million a year for the next 4 years.

Um...why is he holding out again?

Would you be just as opposed if a team had cut him, re-signed him for less money, and then cut him again?

Guaranteed contracts work both ways.

He probably wouldn't need to because he'd be cut.

Tell this to management.

1 - What person playing a game for a living should be making 1 million a year?  Let's not quibble about who is worth what.

2 - The Raiders are an NFL team, with the full standing of any of the other 31 teams.  Why wouldn't they count?  If the Lions give Matthew Stafford a $40M deal, does it "not count" because they're the Lions?

Asomugha is a CB for an NFL team.  Revis is a CB for an NFL team.  It's a comparable transaction.

Why do I never hear this rationale when teams are cutting players?

Because cut players have already received their guaranteed money.  Everyone knows that the dollar amount you put on a contract is meaningless, the only important thing is the guaranteed dollar amount.

And Revis has already received his guaranteed money.

If the money that he would receive in 2011 is conditional on him not holding out (a right that has been negotiated for in collective bargaining, by the way), it's not actually guaranteed, is it?

For the record, am I to presume that according to you, a holdout is A.O.K. as long as there is no "guaranteed" money remaining?  I mean, since the numbers on a contract are "worthless" if not guaranteed, and all.  (Why should they be worthless if "a contract is a contract"?)

In another article I read this wasn't the case. The holdout when he first signed was because he wanted a five year deal and the team wanted a six year deal. Devil's Advocate in me says maybe he was the one who gave in originally and never liked the deal he signed in the first place.

It's guaranteed if he doesn't break his contract himself.  You don't honestly expect the Jets to honor the contract if HE doesn't do you?  If I understand his contract correctly he's already been paid about $14 million dollars for his first 3 years and he'd be paid another $20 million for his next 3 and all he had to do was show up.  He decided that wasn't good enough.  That's fine with me, but don't expect any sympathy from me.

Of course we can quibble!  Quibbling is FUN!

Clearly, Spider-Dan, I was making a joke at the Raiders' expense.  That was not a serious argument.

Asomugha received his contract as he was about to become a free agent, when other teams were free to throw as much money as they pleased his way.  Revis is not a free agent, and will not be one for 3 more years.  There are no other markets competing with New York for his services.  That fact alone makes this an uncomparable transaction.  He is still under contract.  The reason you won't hear me complain when management cuts a player is because NFL contracts (it's fair to assume) stipulate that management has the right to terminate the contract, whereas players do not have the right to terminate their contracts.  The Jets have the contractual right; Revis does not.  That's not to say that I agree that players should have to work in this system, but it is a system that they collectively bargained with their owners.  They should abide by the agreements they made, is all.  I am fundamentally opposed to players holding out while under contract.  As Drew Rosenhaus has stated in various iinterviews, he prefers to never go the holdout route, as it's counterproductive and can result in acrimony.

Funny that you take that position.

The right to hold out is something that has been collectively bargained by the players.  There are specific rules that apply to holdouts, including:

 - in order to accrue a season of seniority, a player under contract must report to training camp 30 days before the first NFL game
 - unsigned franchised players and restricted free agents need to play at least six regular season games in order to earn an accrued season towards free agency

Holding out is, in fact, the player's RIGHT, in exactly the same sense that cutting a player is the team's right.

Spider-Dan, Revis is in violation of both of your listed points, or will be soon, right?

-in order to accrue a season of seniority, a player under contract must report to training camp 30 days before the first NFL game...which will take place on September 9.  The Jets play September 13.  Today is August 12.  He's either 3 days past the "contractual right" you cite (The first week 1 game), or he's 1 day away from a violation (the Jets' week one game).

unsigned franchised players and restricted free agents need to play at least six regular season games in order to earn an accrued season towards free agency
Revis is neither unsigned nor restricted, because he's not a free agent.  Therefore, this rule is inapplicable.

Absent more evidence, my position stands.  Revis has no collectively bargained right to the holdout.  Not after August 9th, at any rate (or is it the 13th?).

Of course he has. And the repercussions are explicitly defined by the CBA.

It's not entirely unlike a draft pick threatening to sit out a season and reenter the draft instead of signing with the team that picked him. It's the players right to do so, but he cannot sign with another team and the repercussions are defined in the CBA.

As fyo stated, Revis' position is completely valid.  He has the right to hold out, and (some of) the repercussions will be:

 - He won't get paid his salary
 - He will not accrue a season of seniority
 - He won't accrue a season towards free agency

However, another repercussion is that the Jets WILL NOT be suing Revis for breach of contract (which is what would happen if he was doing something that he's not allowed to; see: Williams, Ricky).  That's because the players' right to hold out is explicitly negotiated for in the collective bargaining agreement.

Again, FYO, a college kid entering the draft is not under contract.  Nor has he signed a contract to abide by the NFL's rules.  Once again, apples and oranges.

Revis has a right to hold out as much as I do to walk out on my job in violation of my employment contract.  There are repercussions to those actions, as you have enumerated, including losing the year you sat out (as in, it does not count as a contract year).  You sat out a season with 3 years left, you still have 3 seasons left, regardless of whether you got paid. 

I'm also fairly certain that the Jets actually COULD sue Revis, if they so chose, for breach of contract, but would not, as they want him back.

Last, I stated that Revis did not have the right to terminate his contract, originally, and that's what I meant to say rather than "no right to a holdout", as I later wrote.  As you (and Spider-Dan) state, he can hold out all he wants (I was wrong to write that he had no right), but there will be repercussions that make doing so, well, really painful.    The difference between team and player is a team has a right to terminate a contract while a player does not.  That's why I don't complain when teams cut players.  Again, personal preference, I do not like the holdout route.

Not really.  The collective bargaining agreement applies to college kids entering the draft, whether they sign anything or not; Maurice Clarett and Mike Williams can testify to this.  It's common for employees in a unionized business to be forced to comply with the collectively bargained terms of the union that represents labor (in this case, the players).

I doubt that your job has negotiated tiers of repercussions that provide for specific penalties based on the timing and duration of your holdout.

Your job is not remotely comparable to that of an NFL player.  The closest analogy (if you are in a union) would be your ability to strike, but without the unique talents of an top-tier NFL player (one that's in a position to be worth holding out for), you would simply be terminated... which, it bears mentioning, is an option that the Jets have (dumb as it would be for them).

If you want a better analogy, look at NBA/MLB players.  AFAIK, they do not have provisions for holdouts, because their contracts are guaranteed.

The player does not have the right to terminate his contract, and he's not terminating his contract.  (If he were, he'd be shopping himself on the open market.)  But he does have the right to hold out, just as the team has the right to terminate his contract.

Why do you begrudge the players for holding out (i.e. "a contract is a contract") but not the teams for not honoring the contracts that they signed?  If anything, the players should be able to terminate their own contracts, just like the teams can.

Anything with potential to damage the Jets is good for the Dolphins. Keep holding out Revis and while you are at it start making some derogatory tweets, interviews, etc. about the Jets' management, staff, and players. You have my full support.

Probably because I've read enough contracts to know that the empolyer often / usually has more rights.  It's just the way of the world.  In return for their oversized salaries, NFL players deal with the possibility of being cut at a moment's notice.  Again, nothing against your view.  This is just mine.

OK, the employer usually has more rights.  But that doesn't explain why you "dislike" holdouts.

Again: why do you have a problem with the players exercising the limited rights that they have?

^^^Well:
A - It's disingenuous.  "I'm not playing for this amount" is ridiculous; of course he will. Once the games start and the checks don't come, he will cave.  A shocking - shocking - amount of these guys live paycheck to paycheck.
B - It's hurtful to a team attempting to win a Super Bowl.  Their best defensive player is AWOL and games are less than a month from starting.
C - Though it may be his "right" to hold out - and I believe it's his right like I believe it's my right to jaywalk - it's clearly not something that is encouraged by the CBA.  It's just not, in my view, the correct way to go about contract negotiations. 

That's all I have at this hour...

I fully support Darrell Revis's hold out.   I hope he holds out all season long.  Or better yet forever.