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TDMMC Forums => Around the NFL => Topic started by: jtex316 on October 12, 2010, 03:15:14 pm



Title: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: jtex316 on October 12, 2010, 03:15:14 pm
You've heard it time and time again. So why are NFL teams not getting it?

Yes, there's a lot of parity in the NFL in today's day and age. But there are also a lot of bone-headed, avoidable plays that cost teams wins.

If you want to be a good NFL football team, you must be good in all THREE phases of the game:

1. Offense
2. Defense
3. Special Teams

That #3 on my list has been a complete killer for some teams so far. Just horrific - blocked punts, blocked FG attempts, punters dropping the ball, snaps not properly held, penalties, kicking kickoffs out of bounds, coverage...on and on and on.


Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: Dave Gray on October 12, 2010, 03:21:56 pm
I have noticed a lot of bad special teams this year.  The punting game is very underrated.  Controlling field position wins close games.


Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: Sunstroke on October 12, 2010, 07:07:20 pm
... The punting game is very underrated.  Controlling field position wins close games.

You probably shouldn't use "Last year's two pro bowl punters came from the 49ers and Raiders" as support for your statement." ;D



Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: MikeO on October 13, 2010, 08:09:15 am
Never take the "FOOT" out of FOOTBALL


Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: Dave Gray on October 13, 2010, 12:50:51 pm
I know you're joking Stroke, but I'm going to address you anyway.

Special teams is more than just about the quality of the punter, but also of the return team and the coverage team.  Beside, crappy teams punt more, so their punters get more attempts -- noticed more, perhaps?


Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: Sunstroke on October 13, 2010, 01:03:26 pm

I think the first stat that gets considered when voting punters into the pro bowl is actually "net yards," which definitely takes the punt coverage unit into consideration. I don't think the "quantity = noticed more" really plays in the pro bowl voting.

I agree with the general premise that getting better field position consistently will help teams win football games, but sometimes the team is so bad in the other areas that certain aspects of the special teams play (specifically punt coverage) simply don't provide tangible results in the win-loss column.





Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on October 13, 2010, 01:07:33 pm
While I agree with Sunstroke that the punter ought not be the best player on the team, special teams are often underappreciated.

Although special teams don’t account for 1/3 of the plays.  That third of the game often have a higher percentage of game changing plays.

Two special teams situation are either put up points or don’t.  FG and PAT (I don’t consider 2 point tries to be ST, ‘cause you use the regular offense and defense for those plays.)  Such do or die situations are pretty rare on regular offense, unless time is about to expire or you are on 3rd and goal.   Otherwise you can be successful (get a 1st down w/o scoring). 

And while occasionally big plays occur on regular offense.  Punt and kickoffs have the largest opportunity for large yardage swings.  Plus a larger percentage of kickoffs or punts are returned for TDs than the percentage of pass or rush plays that are TDs.  Certainly you see more 70 yard + kickoff or punt returns for a TD than 70 yard pass TD or rushing TD as a percentage of rushing and passing plays. 

And while defensively you always strive for turnovers, there is only one way to plan a forced turnover – the onside kick. 

So in my opinion on a per play basis ST is in fact more important than offense or defense and should be treated that way. 

The most recent superbowl was won on special teams – the onside kick.  And the most recent NE-MIA game was most certainly won and lost on ST.


Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: Phishfan on October 13, 2010, 01:30:04 pm
I think the first stat that gets considered when voting punters into the pro bowl is actually "net yards," which definitely takes the punt coverage unit into consideration. I don't think the "quantity = noticed more" really plays in the pro bowl voting.

You sure seem to be giving a lot of credit to Pro Bowl voters. I always assumed they just voted for their favorite team's players if they were in the running.


Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: Dave Gray on October 13, 2010, 01:32:56 pm
Stroke,

Even when dealing with net yards, if your offense sucks, there's more room to punt for distance, and not trying to pin teams


Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on October 13, 2010, 01:38:53 pm
You sure seem to be giving a lot of credit to Pro Bowl voters. I always assumed they just voted for their favorite team's players if they were in the running.

Not me.  I vote for the players on my least favorite team.  Making the pro-bowl has a nasty tendency to inflate guys egos and have them demand more money or force a trade. 

I fully support Revis demanding to be the highest paid player in the NFL and if not holding out. 


Title: Re: All THREE phases, people!
Post by: BigDaddyFin on October 13, 2010, 06:46:16 pm
Net yards and in 20's.  You can have a great net yardage but if you can't stop the ball inside the 20, you probably suck at punting.