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Title: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Sunstroke on May 27, 2011, 09:28:12 am

May as well go ahead and get this thread fired up...

I am pulling hard for the Heat, obviously, but this really is a no-lose scenario for me. If Miami wins, great. If Dallas wins, then two players who I really like...and that haven't won a title yet, Jason Terry and Jason Kidd, will finally have their rings.

Dirk Nowitzki scares me a bit, but I really think Miami has the team that can beat the Mav's in a 7 game series. I think they're going to find out that Miami is too damned athletic from the wing to slow them down.

GO HEAT!!


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on May 27, 2011, 02:40:45 pm
Heat in 5.  (6 at most)

It's the same story.  Dirk is a fantastic player, but the Mavs don't have the defense to stop the HEAT.  The Mavs will get hot with 3 pointers and steal a game, but they don't have enough to win a series.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: dolfan13 on May 27, 2011, 03:45:53 pm
Best basketball player on the planet, and home court advantage...

Heat win in 5, lebron is ur MVP


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: TonyB0D on May 27, 2011, 11:36:56 pm
Mavs in 7

Mavs have the hungrier players. 
Heat have the youth/athletic advangate, but lack quality depth.
It's a toss-up.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Fau Teixeira on May 28, 2011, 03:46:25 am
Heat in 5. And ask Chicago about the heats depth. Seemed like the heat reserves were way up in the plus/minus stat.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: bsmooth on May 28, 2011, 02:33:10 pm
Heat in 5. And ask Chicago about the heats depth. Seemed like the heat reserves were way up in the plus/minus stat.

Ask the Thunder about the Mavs reserves.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: masterfins on May 29, 2011, 02:30:51 pm
Should be an interesting series.  I'm pulling for the underdog Mavs, I like Cuban as an owner.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Sunstroke on May 31, 2011, 11:51:02 pm
My 92-86 prediction at work today was soooo close.

Miami is going to roll over Dallas. I thought 6 games at the start...I'm hedging toward 5, and unless Dallas figures out a way to slow down Wade & James, it may be a sweep.



Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 03, 2011, 01:48:47 am
You obviously have to give the majority of the credit to Dallas for tonight's comeback, but damn it's hard to ignore Lebron chucking up off balanced 3's in the final 4 minutes for no apparent reason.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 03, 2011, 05:41:46 am
The Heat with one of the epic CHOKE jobs in NBA Finals History. Blowing a 15 pt lead at home late in the 4th quarter.

That's one for the record books. If they lose this series that will haunt Lebron forever! Won't haunt Wade since he already has a ring, but Lebron...yeah that will stick on his resume if they don't win the series.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 03, 2011, 07:21:09 am
It always amazes me when teams have success an entire game doing one thing, and then go away from it in the final minutes. The Heat were playing very well and were dominating the inside game, despite Bosh sucking. So, they go away from that and just start hucking up 3's. Terrible collapse.

I still think they win in 6, but this one will hurt Lebron.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Thundergod on June 03, 2011, 08:34:58 am
It always amazes me when teams have success an entire game doing one thing, and then go away from it in the final minutes. The Heat were playing very well and were dominating the inside game, despite Bosh sucking. So, they go away from that and just start hucking up 3's. Terrible collapse.

I still think they win in 6, but this one will hurt Lebron.

Frustrating to say the least. And the foul they had to give at the end... sigh. Wade said they were supposed to foul Nowitski, but "they" (cough cough Chris) had a brain fart.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on June 03, 2011, 01:35:08 pm
That was extra frustrating.

We played with arrogance in the last 7 minutes.  We just stopped working for our shots and Lebron wasn't bringing the ball in past the 3 point line, so he was having jack up ill-advised, fade-away 3s.  Everything that could go wrong, did go wrong.

It was very reminiscent of the HEAT team early in the year, that couldn't produce in a half-court offense.

And while you have to give some credit to Dallas for making the shots at the end, this is, without question, a choke job from the HEAT. 

If they had won this game, especially without getting calls and getting to the line, it's a dagger -- the series is over.  Now, it's very much alive.  Lots of blame to go around -- Spoelstra, Lebron at the top, but also Chris Bosh for brainfarting at the end.  I question why Chalmers is in the game down the stretch.  Miller or Haslem need to be on the court to close out these games.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: jtex316 on June 03, 2011, 03:26:16 pm
Dwayne Wade for 3 (from the corner to go up by 15) - YES!!!

Time out Mavs

Wade holding up hand "posing" the shot with a serious look in his eyes - complete Poker Face.

Then, here comes LeBron partying it up and trying to give "dap" to Wade for scoring point number 36 of the night.

D-Wade is not even trying to participate in all that - he's walking back to the bench. He's been here before - there's too much time left on the clock to be hooping it up and celebrating.

LeBron got excited to have a big lead in game 2, and his inexperience showed. Then when the Mavs made their initial push, everything started going through LeBron and he didn't even bother driving. He did what he did in Cleveland - jack up long-distance, hero fade-away 3's. It didn't work.

It all went downhill from there.

This is a major choke job and I am more upset at myself for staying up late watching this collapse than I am for the Heat actually collapsing like that.

However - I do think that a Game 2 choke-job is not the same thing as a Game 5 or Game 6 choke-job (in the sense that you can close out a series, but don't because you gag it off). Even down 0-2, the series is not over for the Mavs - just ask the 2006 Heat if it was over after being down 0-2 and down 13 with 5:00 to go in game 3.

A road win in Game 3 for the Heat will quickly put aside this massive gag job and allow the Heat to re-claim home court advantage (this is going 7 games, folks).

MikeO is spot-on here - if the Heat lose this, I'm going to look back at his little party with Wade in front of the Mavs bench with LOTS OF TIME left on the clock and I'm going to be very angry at him for jazzing it up before the game was over. It's a 48-minute game, you HAVE to play all 48 minutes to win in this league, especially in the Finals. Did LeBron think the Mavs would just roll over easily? There's a reason they are in the Finals.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: jtex316 on June 03, 2011, 03:37:34 pm
As far as the 1 foul to give situation:

I think you can actually cost yourself the game by fouling, if you screw it up (which at that point, was entirely possible for the Heat to do).

If you foul Dirk in the act of shooting, you have a good chance of him making it and going to the line for a three-point play. Chris Bosh cannot be trusted to pull this off.

What I would have liked to have seen is an old-school Delay of Game warning by the Heat on the inbounds pass, where the defender steps on the line and the ref blows the whistle. This would allow the Heat to see the play developing - teams used to do this all the time and don't do it anymore for some reason.

The Mavs were hot - the Heat had to win in regulation last night, because they weren't going to win in OT.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 03, 2011, 03:38:33 pm
I still say the Heat win if this game goes back to Miami. Never been a big fan of the 2-3-2 format.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: jtex316 on June 03, 2011, 04:43:11 pm
The Mavs simply cannot keep up with the Heat, when the Heat actually want to win the game for all 48 minutes of the contest.

It took the biggest gag job of all gag jobs to barely squeeze by the Heat in a miraculous fashion - the Mavs were playing poorly turning the ball over a lot and getting run up and down the court after the end of the 1st half. They barely edged the Heat out by the slimmest of margins - you can easily make the argument that the Heat beat the Heat. Is there another professional NBA team that couldn't make a comeback with the way the Heat blew it last night?

I feel that this will be short lived, and it's big news right now because it's A. the Finals and B. it's the Heat. Once the Heat win either Game 3 or 4 (they will win one of those contests), the series will be at least 2-2, if not 3-1 Heat, and then the conversation will come full circle to talking about how the Mavs can't keep up with the Heat and blah blah blah...


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Spider-Dan on June 03, 2011, 04:47:22 pm
Wade holding up hand "posing" the shot with a serious look in his eyes - complete Poker Face.

Then, here comes LeBron partying it up and trying to give "dap" to Wade for scoring point number 36 of the night.

D-Wade is not even trying to participate in all that - he's walking back to the bench. He's been here before - there's too much time left on the clock to be hooping it up and celebrating.
Wade was smiling and laughing with LeBron.  Give me a break.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 03, 2011, 05:38:26 pm


MikeO is spot-on here - if the Heat lose this, I'm going to look back at his little party with Wade in front of the Mavs bench with LOTS OF TIME left on the clock and I'm going to be very angry at him for jazzing it up before the game was over. It's a 48-minute game, you HAVE to play all 48 minutes to win in this league, especially in the Finals. Did LeBron think the Mavs would just roll over easily? There's a reason they are in the Finals.

Lebron showed again why everyone outside of South Florida hates him. He gives people reasons to hate him. Last night was just another. He can get all pissed at Barkley and everything, but Lebron needs to look in the mirror and realize people don't hate him just because. There are valid reasons why there is so much hate towards him. And he brings it ALL on himself!


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Thundergod on June 03, 2011, 06:37:28 pm
O.M.F.G. Did I miss the confetti, bands marching all over the court, cheerleaders doing backflips holding signs up with the numbers 6/3 on it? They were enjoying the MOMENT. As if that shit never happens in sports. Get off it already.

...and people enjoy watching the planned TD celebrations by WR's in the NFL.    ::)


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 03, 2011, 07:11:30 pm
O.M.F.G. Did I miss the confetti, bands marching all over the court, cheerleaders doing backflips holding signs up with the numbers 6/3 on it? They were enjoying the MOMENT. As if that shit never happens in sports. Get off it already.

...and people enjoy watching the planned TD celebrations by WR's in the NFL.    ::)

They enjoy the moment after every basket. Wade standing damn near on the Mavs bench with his hand in the air for what seemed forever making faces and holding his foul threw hand while Lebron jumps and is punching his chest....its overdone to the 1000th degree.

How about "ENJOY THE MOMENT" when you win the game and there is 0:00 on the clock. Until then, act like ya been there before!


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Thundergod on June 03, 2011, 07:25:47 pm
Yeah. Uh huh.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Sunstroke on June 03, 2011, 08:36:54 pm
Wade standing damn near on the Mavs bench...

He took the shot from damned near on the Mavs bench...so it wouldn't really have been spontaneous if he had run to halfcourt (ala T.O.) to freeze-frame the release pose.

with his hand in the air for what seemed forever

Just replayed the video... One mississippi, two mississippi, three missi--oops, forever

They enjoy the moment after every basket.

Haven't missed a play throughout the playoffs, and it's probably closer to one out of six that they do anything more than point to each other or a high-5 running downcourt...not "every basket" (100%), but hey, what's a little exaggeration if it gets the point across?

~

Miami gacked this one...no ifs, ands or buts about it. They got too full of themselves and tried to mail it in for a win...and Dirk & the Mavs 'jacked that shit quick. I expect Miami to have a little different focus on Sunday, but if they don't, and they forget that they need to play a full 48, Dallas has more than enough talent to beat them again.



Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 03, 2011, 08:41:36 pm
He took the shot from damned near on the Mavs bench...so it wouldn't really have been spontaneous if he had run to halfcourt (ala T.O.) to freeze-frame the release pose.


How about just run up the court and act like its just another shot. There was still what, 6 min left in the game


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Pats2006 on June 03, 2011, 10:26:52 pm
The best part of the game for me was Dirk blowing by Bosh and he weak D to score the game winner!! Bosh not so bad now huh..


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 04, 2011, 02:39:44 am
Maybe I missed a highlight, but I didn't think the reaction by Wade and Lebron after Wade hit that 3 was all that bad. Showboating a little, but nothing that would make me scream disrespect. Maybe I missed something. I mean, you are up by 15 and SHOULD have a 2-0 Finals lead locked up. Some jubilation is to be expected.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on June 06, 2011, 10:29:33 am
Game 4 is now a must win for the Mavs.  The HEAT got a lot of ticky-tack calls on them, chasing down rebounds and stuff, and were still able to hold on to that win.  It was series changing. 


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: jtex316 on June 06, 2011, 11:36:04 am
It's highly unlikely now that the Mavs will win the series. They have to beat the Heat 3 of the next 4 games, with at minimum one of those victories in Miami. Can anyone see the Mavs winning against the Heat 3 times out of the next 4 games? Maybe they win 1 more game in this series and tie it at 2, and maybe they win game 4 and then force a final game by winning game 6, but I don't see how the Mavs can beat the Heat 3 of the next 4 (which needs to include at least 2 victories in a row)


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Sunstroke on June 06, 2011, 12:41:44 pm

I think Dallas will win one of the next two games played in Dallas, but it's over as soon as Miami gets home.

That's good I suppose...I think it's better when a team wins the Finals on their home court. It allows the fans to get crazy in earnest.



Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 06, 2011, 06:34:47 pm
Miami is so much better than Dallas it isn't even funny. The fact that these games are so close is amazing.



Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on June 07, 2011, 11:13:50 am
Miami is winning in spite of getting screwed by the ref's whistle.  Miami had 6 loose ball fouls on rebounds in game 3.  It got Dallas (and Dirk, shooting pretty much 100%) in the bonus WAY early.  Meanwhile, Lebron is taking 4 foul shots a game.  ...Wade too, despite attacking the rim.  It was a very one-sided affair.  Bosh getting poked in the eye and missing both an offensive and defensive possession comes to mind, as well as a foul on Haslem, while he was boxing out Dirk.  I guess Haslem fouled Dirk with his spine.

I'm not suggesting that anything is rigged, but I think that the refs need to review the tape and not get tricked by Dallas' acting.  Dirk shoots awkwardly on his own, so he draws fouls because they assume, though body language, that he was shoved.  It makes me think that there's no way that Dallas will be able to get a win in Miami.

Also, this commentary on Lebron is nuts.  Basketball is more than just scoring points.  Wade is getting covered by Jason Kidd.  That's where you go with the ball.  In game 3, Lebron was very unselfish and did the things it took to win the game.  The guy can't win, even when he wins.  I feel better about it, because it appears that (most of) the media is getting back on his side.  After that one idiot reported asked that very loaded question, a bunch of people came to his defense.  ...so that's good.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Phishfan on June 07, 2011, 11:27:41 am
I'm not really watching the series, but am keeping up with it. You are actually going to call out the refs for giving favor to the Mavs, when a bad call at the end of the first quarter gave the Heat three points they shouldn't have been awarded (in a two point game)? I'd say it looks like a give an get from this outsider's view.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on June 07, 2011, 11:54:18 am
If you haven't been watching the series, I can understand you saying that.  It's everywhere in the media down here, too.  It's not one big call.  It's a slow drain, over the course of the game, allowing the Mavs to play at a higher level, and making the HEAT back off, with early, often, and tick-tack fouls -- the kind that aren't highlighted because they're away from the ball.

I'm not complaining about one call.  I'm not even complaining, really.  I'm just saying that I expect that kind of stuff to even out a bit, making it hard for the Mavs to compensate.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 08, 2011, 02:08:56 am
Wow.  Mr. Grey, I'm surprised at  your level of homerism.  This whole series, I've thought, the Heat have gotten almost all of the whistles that were 50/50 or worse.  AKA:  Wade and especially Lebron getting free throws whenever they decided to flop.   I've been lurking...as is my want...but I must speak up now.

FULL DISCLOSURE:  I AM A DALLAS MAVERICKS FAN.    I've been rooting for them since the 80s.  I've sat through some of the worst basketball anyone has ever seen.  But as a Dolphin fan, I'm used to poor ability being displayed by my team in recent memory, and rooting for them anyways. 

Point 1)  Miami Heat fans should never complain about fouls.  You were given a championship based on fouls in 2006.  You have no basis to complain.  EVER.  Check history books for the proof.

Point 2)  This series is basically 51/49)% in terms of who's a better team.  Does Miami have better athletes?  YES.  UNQUESTIONABLY.
             Half the league has better athletes than the Mavs.  What that half doesn't have is determination and mental toughness.  The Mavs are a team based on their mental toughness.  But when it matters, which team is stronger down the stretch despite an obvious talent advantage?  The Mavs just beat 3 teams who were undeniably the better athletic teams.  Why did they win?  Each team was different, but in the end, the Mavs showed, they had the uncanny ability to make up for athletic deficiencies.  I have no idea if the Mavs are mentally tough enough to gut this series out, but I do know they will not go down without a fight.

Point 3)  Lebron James is a total bitch.  He has more athletic ability than any other player in recent memory.  But mentally, he is a child.  He's been given everything he's ever desired.  Star status?  CHECK.  Millions of dollars?  CHECK.  Adoring fans who disregard any flaw in his game?  BIG CHECK.  Lebron is what the Sopranos would call a mental midget.  When the going gets tough, he shrinks and defers all duties to other teammates...like to Wade, which is why I'm sure he signed in Miami (he didn't want the pressure of being the #1 guy).  I don't want to mince words here.  Wade is a man...a big, NBA player man.  He is everything said about him and more.  He is a truly great professional basketball player.  I have nothing but the utmost respect for him and his game.  Lebron, however, is a bitch, and has the toughness (inside and out) of a 6 year old girl.

I expect a 7 game series from this Finals because these teams are so evenly matched.  I'm sure the Heat will go on to win many championships because of their talent advantages.  They are, after all, the best team player collusion can put together.  But for the sake of the NBA and the Mavs, I hope that is not this year.  This is a classic struggle between Brer Fox and Brer Rabbit.  Brer Fox sure has the physical ability to rend Brer Rabbit into pieces, but Brer Rabbit knows what needs to be done in order to outsmart his foe.  If the Heat win, they were supposed to, and nothing more is to be gained. However, If the Mavs are to win this series, they must show they were the wiser basketball team in the end.  Now if they can just hit their wide open shots...

I've been known to be wrong about this stuff before...I'm a Dolphin fan for crying out loud...I never know when to quit rooting against reality, but I just had to give my 2 cents worth.



Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on June 08, 2011, 11:23:22 am
I don't think you're being honest with yourself about Wade or James getting fouls for flopping.  Lebron James is taking like 4 foul shots a game.

Fouls weren't a big problem last night.

I'm not frustrated with officiating, so much as I'm frustrated with my own players not closing, and abandoning their game plan every game, with about 5 minutes left.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Sunstroke on June 08, 2011, 01:29:20 pm
Wow.  Mr. Grey, I'm surprised at  your level of homerism.  This whole series, I've thought, the Heat have gotten almost all of the whistles that were 50/50 or worse. 

...FULL DISCLOSURE:  I AM A DALLAS MAVERICKS FAN.   

And you're surprised at Dave's level of homerism? Is that view perhaps skewed by your own homerism?

As someone who has watched every game and ISN'T a fan of either team (Phoenix Suns fan here), I'd lean more toward Dave's side of the argument, in regards to the officiating. I don't think it's been too bad either way, but I think more 50/50 calls have gone Dallas' way than Miami's.



Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 08, 2011, 02:48:44 pm
For once, I think the calls have been pretty fair, with Miami getting the calls in Miami and Dallas getting the close calls in Dallas.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 08, 2011, 02:55:18 pm
Hey, I'm just stirring the pot a little.  Too much Heat love around here. ;D

I don't know what Lebron's deal was last night.  He was not there to play ball for sure.  Maybe another teammate is sleeping with his mom again.  Wade, himself, is an accomplished flopper, but I guess that's how ball is played in the Eastern Conference.  I have no major beefs with the officiating this series, actually.  Sure, they missed the over and back call on Chalmers' 3 pointer at the end of the 1st quarter in game 3, but the Mavs had 3 more quarters to win and couldn't do it.  If anyone other than Dirk could do anything at the end of that game, Mavs are up 3-1 right now.

This is a great series, though, and I'm looking forward to 3 more games.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Pappy13 on June 08, 2011, 03:20:38 pm
And you're surprised at Dave's level of homerism? Is that view perhaps skewed by your own homerism?

As someone who has watched every game and ISN'T a fan of either team (Phoenix Suns fan here), I'd lean more toward Dave's side of the argument, in regards to the officiating. I don't think it's been too bad either way, but I think more 50/50 calls have gone Dallas' way than Miami's.
He does have a great point though about the Heat winning the championship against the Mavs a few years ago. It was the Mavs then complaining about the fouls and the Heat fans pretty much saying "that's the breaks".

I'm not a Mavs fan, but I do live in Dallas so I pretty much are forced to listen to Mavs talk on Sports radio. I remember the Mavs/Heat finals a few years ago and thought there was quite a lot of whining from Mavs fans about officiating, so I can understand where he's coming from. What goes around comes around.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: bsmooth on June 08, 2011, 07:49:41 pm
I don't think you're being honest with yourself about Wade or James getting fouls for flopping.  Lebron James is taking like 4 foul shots a game.

Fouls weren't a big problem last night.

I'm not frustrated with officiating, so much as I'm frustrated with my own players not closing, and abandoning their game plan every game, with about 5 minutes left.

Both Wade and LeBron have developed a serious reputation this season for flopping for fouls. I have seen multiple writers even talk about. the FIFA rules on flopping to draw a foul needing to be put into the NBA as a whole. Are they Divac or Malone level? No, but they do seem to flop a lot


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Pats2006 on June 08, 2011, 09:47:20 pm
I don't think you're being honest with yourself about Wade or James getting fouls for flopping.  Lebron James is taking like 4 foul shots a game.

Fouls weren't a big problem last night.

I'm not frustrated with officiating, so much as I'm frustrated with my own players not closing, and abandoning their game plan every game, with about 5 minutes left.

Im glad you said this.. its almost sad to watch


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 09, 2011, 03:19:38 am
Maybe the refs are apologizing to Dallas for 2006.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 09, 2011, 12:09:09 pm
Are we forgetting Lebron's flop at the end of the 1st quarter of game 4?  He didn't even get touched and pretended like he was hammered.  He got 2 free throws and a technical assessed against Rick Carlisle for complaining about a blatantly wrong call.

I'll freely admit JJ Barea is a flopper.  He's looking to flop as a defender, and because he's so tiny, he gets some calls to go his way.  But then again, the refs know this and usually don't blow their whistles unless needed....mostly. 

I think this has been a pretty evenly refereed series so far.  I just think Wade, Lebron, & Heat fans are not used to to refs not calling ticky tack fouls against their opponents. 


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on June 09, 2011, 12:42:55 pm
Are we forgetting Lebron's flop at the end of the 1st quarter of game 4?  He didn't even get touched and pretended like he was hammered.  He got 2 free throws and a technical assessed against Rick Carlisle for complaining about a blatantly wrong call.

I think that it's counter-productive to argue one play.  If it's an example of a larger problem, fine, but Wade and James just haven't been getting to the line, so saying that they've been flopping just isn't the story here.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 10, 2011, 01:53:48 am
Ironic that the only flopping was done by Dallas' backups.  BUT, none of them were called as fouls against the Heat, which was the correct call 90% of the time.  Of course, the refs did penalize spare part, Brian Cardinal, for properly defending Wade's charge that ultimately kept Wade from playing crucial minutes in the game.  The refs blew the call entirely, which can't be argued.  The Mavs got screwed on a call, Wade got hurt because he ran into a bigger player, and the Mavs overcame the bad call and won the game.  That being said, the officiating was very good tonight...and overall for the series.  Maybe, just maybe, the NBA is actually going to let Cuban's team win one because he is shutting up.

If I was a Heat fan, I'd be shitting in my pants.  The last 4 games, the Heat have not gotten the job done at all in the 4th quarter.  Period.  There is no such thing as an easy game between these two teams, but it's VERY clear who is the tougher team. 


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 10, 2011, 01:55:23 am
Lebron isn't getting to the line because he isn't being physical. There was a pretty bad no-call on Miami late in Game 5 where I believe Marion had a breakaway and was clearly hacked on the arm. I don't think the calls are going against Miami, I just think they aren't being treated like superstars in the Finals and they aren't used to it. In the regular season, the stars get the calls, but it's different in the playoffs. Unless you are Jordan, in which case you can throw a guy onto the floor if it allows you a better look at the basket.

As far as the game goes, Lebron probably had the most unimpressive triple-double I have ever seen. Hard to knock a TD, but damn if he didn't look unimpressive.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: bsmooth on June 10, 2011, 02:03:03 am
I just want to put the facts out there... From the box scores

Game 1   Heat-26 Mavs-32  Heat win
Game 2   Heat-24 Mavs-21  Mavs win
Game 3   Heat-15 Mavs-27  Heat win
Game 4   Heat-24 Mavs-30  Mavs win
Game 5   Heat-26 Mavs-27  Mavs win
Totals         115        137

Mavs have a 22 free throw advantage through 5 games which equates to 4.4 shots a game. But two game where the Mavs had 6 or more free throws the Heat won.
So officiating is not the reason the Heat are down 3-2. The fact an injured Wade outscored James is.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 10, 2011, 02:07:56 am
Wow.  I had no idea that James was even in the game in the 2nd half, much less scored a triple double.  Has there ever been a more forgettable triple double?


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 10, 2011, 02:23:47 am
Saw this on fark.com tonight:  I saw LeBron before the game and I asked for $1. He gave me $.75. I said "where's the rest"? He replied "I don't have a 4th quarter".


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Thundergod on June 10, 2011, 02:46:50 am
Weak defense played against you. And hittin every goddamn 3 pointer you chuck up, ya, no ones beating you. The country is all smiles now. Que lindo...


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 10, 2011, 03:56:04 am
Yeah, the Mavs were just hitting all of their shots. Terry's long 3 against Lebron was guarded very well, but he hit it. With a hand in his face and 5 feet behind the 3 point line he hits it, what can you do?


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Landshark on June 10, 2011, 09:04:41 am
I still like the Heat's chances, only because I've seen this happen so many times in the Finals.  The underdog team takes a 3-2 lead, but the favorite team has the final two games on their floor and they end up winning both. 


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on June 10, 2011, 10:21:21 am
I am still not happy with the officiating in game 5.  Same story -- fouls away from the ball, and HEAT not getting calls going to the rim.  The charge call against James (while the defender had his foot in the circle) was unforgivable, and pretty much ended the game.  There was an earlier charge call on Bosh where the defender only had one foot on the ground.  Those kind of calls don't result in shots, but they break momentum cost you points.

Credit to Dallas last night for finally hitting big shots, as a team.  Their role players knocked down a ton of 3s, which made it hard to overcome.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Pappy13 on June 10, 2011, 10:30:17 am
I am still not happy with the officiating in game 5.  Same story -- fouls away from the ball, and HEAT not getting calls going to the rim.  The charge call against James (while the defender had his foot in the circle) was unforgivable, and pretty much ended the game.  There was an earlier charge call on Bosh where the defender only had one foot on the ground.  Those kind of calls don't result in shots, but they break momentum cost you points.

Credit to Dallas last night for finally hitting big shots, as a team.  Their role players knocked down a ton of 3s, which made it hard to overcome.
And it still sounds a LOT like Mavs fans in 2006.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Dave Gray on June 10, 2011, 11:20:49 am
^ I don't remember that series, in terms of fouls, but it very well may be the case.

It still doesn't make it right.  You shouldn't have "make-up calls" for something 5 years ago.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Spider-Dan on June 10, 2011, 11:45:37 am
It's highly unlikely now that the Mavs will win the series. They have to beat the Heat 3 of the next 4 games, with at minimum one of those victories in Miami. Can anyone see the Mavs winning against the Heat 3 times out of the next 4 games? Maybe they win 1 more game in this series and tie it at 2, and maybe they win game 4 and then force a final game by winning game 6, but I don't see how the Mavs can beat the Heat 3 of the next 4 (which needs to include at least 2 victories in a row)
In late-breaking news, a series is not over when one team leads 2-1.

The Heat still have a good chance to win (I think it will go 7), but declaring a team "highly unlikely to win" when they are down 2-1 is just silly.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Pappy13 on June 10, 2011, 12:44:22 pm
^ I don't remember that series, in terms of fouls, but it very well may be the case.

It still doesn't make it right.  You shouldn't have "make-up calls" for something 5 years ago.
I don't think you quite understand what I'm saying. It doesn't have anything to do with "make-up" calls, it's just the breaks of the game.  Sometimes the calls go your way and sometimes they don't. When you are winning the games those calls don't seem like a big deal, but when you are losing they are much more important. The Maverick fans will forever see the 2006 finals as a series where they didn't get the foul calls and couldn't win it all because of that, but the reality probably is that the foul calls had little to do with it which is how the Heat fans remember it. Should the Mavs win it this year, it will be the exact opposite. That's what I'm trying to point out. A few calls here and there don't change the fact that Miami is being outplayed in the series.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on June 10, 2011, 01:16:03 pm
In late-breaking news, a series is not over when one team leads 2-1.



Unless it is a three game series. 


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mboss on June 10, 2011, 03:45:05 pm
Are we forgetting Lebron's flop at the end of the 1st quarter of game 4?  He didn't even get touched and pretended like he was hammered.  He got 2 free throws and a technical assessed against Rick Carlisle for complaining about a blatantly wrong call.

I'll freely admit JJ Barea is a flopper.  He's looking to flop as a defender, and because he's so tiny, he gets some calls to go his way.  But then again, the refs know this and usually don't blow their whistles unless needed....mostly. 

I think this has been a pretty evenly refereed series so far.  I just think Wade, Lebron, & Heat fans are not used to to refs not calling ticky tack fouls against their opponents. 
Lets not forget LeBron acting like he got poked in the face by D. Rose in the Bulls series, only then to wink over to his bench. Not that it decided the series...but just piling on.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: bsmooth on June 10, 2011, 06:21:36 pm
I am still not happy with the officiating in game 5.  Same story -- fouls away from the ball, and HEAT not getting calls going to the rim.  The charge call against James (while the defender had his foot in the circle) was unforgivable, and pretty much ended the game.  There was an earlier charge call on Bosh where the defender only had one foot on the ground.  Those kind of calls don't result in shots, but they break momentum cost you points.

Credit to Dallas last night for finally hitting big shots, as a team.  Their role players knocked down a ton of 3s, which made it hard to overcome.

It was 26 to 27. Free throws did not make the difference in this game. Also as the Heat have proven twice, getting an significant advantage against them in free throws does not mean victory.
Officiating is not the story of his series. The fact that Wade seems more like a superstar baller in the vein of Jordan as opposed to James is the bigger story.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Spider-Dan on June 10, 2011, 07:12:57 pm
I saw a funny joke today:

"I asked LeBron James if I could borrow a dollar and he said OK, then handed me $0.75.  I said, 'Where's the other 25 cents?' and he said, 'Sorry, I don't have a 4th quarter.'"


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on June 11, 2011, 12:23:44 pm
Saw this on fark.com tonight:  I saw LeBron before the game and I asked for $1. He gave me $.75. I said "where's the rest"? He replied "I don't have a 4th quarter".

I saw a funny joke today:

"I asked LeBron James if I could borrow a dollar and he said OK, then handed me $0.75.  I said, 'Where's the other 25 cents?' and he said, 'Sorry, I don't have a 4th quarter.'"

Spider - Me too in this very thread. 


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Spider-Dan on June 11, 2011, 04:51:17 pm
Maybe that's where I read it.  -50 points to me.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Landshark on June 12, 2011, 10:19:23 pm
Dallas is currently up by 8 early in the fourth quarter, but look at this stat line thus far.

Dallas 8-12 on free throws

Miami 18-31 on free throws

Now what's this I'm hearing about the calls going the Mavs way?


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 12, 2011, 10:22:54 pm
Dallas is currently up by 8 early in the fourth quarter, but look at this stat line thus far.

Dallas 8-12 on free throws

Miami 18-31 on free throws

Now what's this I'm hearing about the calls going the Mavs way?

Looks like the NBA wants a game 7 and it makes Tim Donaghy seem like he never acted alone.

The fact Miami cant' hit a foul shot though, maybet he NBA wants to end it tonight! lol


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 12, 2011, 10:30:23 pm
That "and 1" was a complete joke. This game is a joke.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 12, 2011, 10:37:55 pm
And the Heat have just given up. No effort to get the rebound, just trying to draw fouls on nonsense. Can't blame them as they have twice as many FT attempts as Dallas, so they are correct in assuming David Stern is their 6th man.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 12, 2011, 10:47:18 pm
The Heat with one of the epic CHOKE jobs in NBA Finals History. Blowing a 15 pt lead at home late in the 4th quarter.

That's one for the record books. If they lose this series that will haunt Lebron forever! Won't haunt Wade since he already has a ring, but Lebron...yeah that will stick on his resume if they don't win the series.

I said it, and it came true! Game 2 was the turning point. Blowing that huge lead at home....can't rebound from that as a team!!


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: EDGECRUSHER on June 12, 2011, 10:50:44 pm
I wouldn't say that as they won the next game, but it certainly didn't help. IMO, the Heat are obviously very talented but aside from Wade, don't have the heart of a champion or the makeup of a TEAM. They can come close as they did this year and may even win it next year, but as of now they are just a collection of talent and not a cohesive unit.

Wade is still better than Lebron.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 12, 2011, 10:56:31 pm
I wouldn't say that as they won the next game, but it certainly didn't help. IMO, the Heat are obviously very talented but aside from Wade, don't have the heart of a champion or the makeup of a TEAM. They can come close as they did this year and may even win it next year, but as of now they are just a collection of talent and not a cohesive unit.

Wade is still better than Lebron.

Lebron, 2nd best player on his own team. In this Finals he was the 3rd best player on the court. That is a FACT!



Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: Thundergod on June 13, 2011, 01:13:31 am
Miami doesn't make the Finals without LeBron, Wade had his own disappearing act with Chicago. Against Dallas, agreed, 2nd best. It was a team effort to lose this series.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 13, 2011, 01:29:11 am
Dwayne Wade was the only member of the Heat who wanted to win this series.  Lebron had no idea how to deal with basketball when men were playing against him...as opposed to children. 

Chris Bosh tried, sorta, but in the end, was a total non factor. 

There is no doubt who the better team is.  Did the Heat have better talent?  Sure.  But they were not the better TEAM.  When Dirk couldn't make it happen, Terry did, and the Heat had no response. 


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 13, 2011, 01:34:55 am
The Heat were "Miami Price," the best team collusion could buy, and they couldn't win it. 

This is the best outcome for the NBA.  They had a team filled with stars, and no drive.  And simply, the team who wanted it more won. 


There were no bad calls that caused this.  There was no conspiracy.  THE BETTER TEAM WON!

I'm proud to be a MAVS fan tonight.  And proud that Mark Cuban let the original owner, my former neighbor, Don Carter, be the first person to hoist the trophy.  It was the biggest class move I've ever seen in the history of professional sports.  PERIOD.  I don't have the superlatives to say more about the sheer class of that move.

HERE!  HERE! to the 2010-2011 Dallas Mavericks!  May the Dolphins have the class to know what it takes to win a championship! 

The 2010-2011 Dallas Mavericks!  The best team in the NBA without question!


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 13, 2011, 01:59:17 am
If the Heat had any heart...or any true desire, they would have won this.  The Heat feel they can win this any year...except 2011.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: bsmooth on June 13, 2011, 04:09:19 am
For the record the final tally was Heat- 148 to Mavs- 155 in fouls. Pretty close over 6 games.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: mecadonzilla on June 13, 2011, 11:45:03 am
I have a lot of vitriol to spew about Lebron, which I did in the other thread, but I want to take this time to talk about the rest of the Heat.

Wade is an incredible talent and were he not on this team, he'd be one of my favorite players (LOVED him in college, too).  I have nothing bad to say about him.  He was this team's leader and played each game of this series to win.

Chris Bosh is a bad mamma jamma, too.  He's not a super star, but he's pretty damn good.  Had the Heat gone to him more down the stretch who knows what would have happened.

Mario Chalmers was an incredible role player for the Heat.  When wade went down in that one game, I was worried because Chalmers was going to get more minutes.  Every time he shot the ball, I figured it was going to go in.

I can also root for Eric Spoelstra.  He did a good job of coaching his team this far.  It's hard to root against the little guy who starts at the bottom and works his way to the top.

I'm glad my team won, and it makes the victory even sweeter to beat a team (except for Lebron) that was playing at the top of their game.


Title: Re: NBA FINALS: Heat-Mavericks
Post by: MikeO on June 14, 2011, 06:29:39 am
You can't spell asphyxiate without Heat.