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I am quite sure I've bitten off more than I can chew for this weekend and I need some advice as to how you would approach this if you were faced with both events?

Saturday morning I'm running a Warrior Dash with a buddy.  For reasons I'll keep to myself, I didn't feel like I could say no.  For folks who don't know what the Warrior Dash is, it's a 5K obstacle course up (and down) a mountain (some aren't - this one is located on a ski resort in New Hampshire so it's going to be straight up and straight down). 

Web site here:

http://www.warriordash.com/

Here is where my "problem" comes in...

I'm running a 10K the next morning:

http://www.mainetoday.com/enternews/042514.html

Three slight things working in my favor: 

1:  My heat on Saturday is at 11 am, so I should have almost 20 full hours to recover my legs.
2:  Once you get into the "thick of things" the Warrior Dash can be "hurry up and wait" to get on to an obstacle, so it's not constant movement.  IE - I'm not running 3.1 miles up a hill the day before.
3:  The 10K is a trail run, it's not paved.  It starts paved for the first quarter mile and then it's trails the rest of the way, so it will be much easier on my lower body than a typical road race (pounding wise).

Bottom line - the Warrior Dash is going to take a lot out of me.  I'm running this as a favor.  My buddy wants to post a sub :45 time.  Would you:

1:  Blow up one race and sacrifice the other?  What I mean by that is - shoot for the sub :45 on the Warrior Dash knowing darn well it's going to mean I'll probably be running a 12:00 mile pace the next day.  Or do I take the Dash slow and steady and put something in the tank and maintain for the 10?
2:  Take it easy on both and feel accomplished to have finished two pretty big events, back to back?

How would you attack this weekend?  Thoughts?

See, this is weird to me. I didn't know people ran those obstacle course races for time. To me they're all about just finishing and having a good time. Of course, I'm kind of old school. I like to run FAST. A race with obstacles is NOT meant to be run FAST. So, I'd just chillax on the Warrior Dash and then kill the 10k.

I did the Down and Dirty Mud Run 10k and it took me well over an hour and I did not care. (I also basically lost my shorts in the final mud pit.)

Either way, I'm totally jealous because it's still too hot here to race.

I'd give my all on the first race and whatever's left in the tank the next day...

Make sure you hydrate and get plenty of energy. Massage and stretching can help cut the soreness.

I'd do the opposite.  I'd lollygag through the first one and save up for the 10K.

Then rope your friend into running the 10K with you the following day.

Is there a rule that the two of you have to stay together for the Warrior Run?  Or would it suffice that you were a few paces behind him.  Maybe get "squeezed out" on the first or second obstacle, get stuck in the crowd and let him go ahead without you, then take your sweet time finishing.

The race is timed, just like any road race.  I think a person who has a realistic shot of finishing in the top three of their heat would want to "run fast."  You get your name engraved on a steel helmet and other prizes, etc.  Other than that...I'm not sure what his deal is with wanting to finish so quickly.  He's all "I'm not waiting for people, I'm this...I'm that."

Me?  Obstacle courses aren't really my thing.  I don't mind them, but I'm definitely more of a road race guy.  I had my fill of obstacle courses in the military!  These things - I'm not seeing the rush.  You're exhausted, which could cause errors.  You're wet, the course is wet, you're muddy, the course is muddy.  A huge part of me is thinking of telling my buddy "I'll see you at the end" and just doing my thing.  My worst case scenario would be to fall off a cargo net and break an ankle because I'm trying to post a :45 minute time on a freakin' Warrior Dash...

I'm in a weird place with my road races.  I'm running, generally, around a 9:15 mile right now until I hit the four mile mark.  At that point I'm a little all over the place.  I ran last night with a migraine (not the smartest thing I've ever done, but I had to get some work in) and was under 10.  If I could chose the order of things, I would much rather have the 10K be first - my pride would want to post a 60:00 or better (that would be a PB for me on a 10K, I haven't broken 60:00 yet...and I don't think I'm going to this weekend).

Weather wise, we've caught a break.  Today and tomorrow highs are in the 80's and it' muggy.  Saturday is looking to be 65-70, no humidity at all.  Should be even cooler in the mountains.  My race on Sunday is on the ocean, which will be perfect (especially with a 9 am gun).

That's what I'd do, and then take your time.

That's what I was thinking too.  The worst case scenario would be to get hurt on the one you don't really care about that prevents you from doing the one you have trained for.  And with muddy shoes and muddy courses and over-eager people climbing things, up and down a hill...  its a real possibility!

Maine, you need to start adding in some speedwork to your training. Some tempo runs and mile repeats will get you faster.

My knees are swelling to the size of basketballs,and aching just reading this thread...Maine is going to run this weekend than I will this entire year... :D  :'( :-[

I would have fun with the obstacle course,and save myself for the race the next day....(Schedule knee surgeries for first thing Monday morning...)

I think most friends would probably understand you're also running a race tomorrow..

I just wanted to wish you good luck...

I can't speak for your particular Warrior Dash, but I have some friends that did it and it wasn't athletic.  They're all fat, out of shape bums.  You run in the mud wearing silly costumes (one dude wore a chicken suit) and then, when it's over, there's a big celebration and everyone drinks beer.

If you're looking to go be a serious competitor, Warrior Dash might not be the place for that.

It's like the Red Bull flying contest of races.

That's exactly how I see it. I ran it for my birthday and it was just for fun. People walk the entire course. If you want to run fast, do a road (or trail as long as it's not aggressive) race.

^^ not all are like that.  Some are competitive like adventure races and stuff. 

My personal opinion is that if you are going to do it ... then do it. Carb up before your Saturday race then it's ice baths, re-hydration and more carbs to prepare for the Sunday race.

Best of luck to you. Sounds like a tough weekend

Actually sounds like a fun weekend.

Ahem..Mr Maine..can we please get an Update?  ;D

^^ Don't think you want that...

Now we definitely need to hear about it.

Dave - whoever told you the Warrior Dash wasn't "athletic" was full of crap.  At least the one we did.

Anyone can sign up for anything.  It doesn't mean they do it well.

Saturday started with a sprint up Gunstock Mountain, which has a 2,500 foot elevation.  We didn't hit the first obstacle until the top of the mountain.  Completely and utterly gassed from running / brisk walking straight up a mountain the first obstacle was a series of walls that you had to either jump or vault over, separated by barbed wire you had to climb under.  I think it was eight walls total to vault.  The walls came up to my hip, so I am guessing they were three feet high.  The barbed wire was so low to the ground I had to do one of my best ever military crawls to get under it.  Once inside they were separated so closely you had to really work your legs to get over the next wall.

The path then worked it's way down the mountain, which was almost as brutal as going up - it was straight down.  People were falling all around me.  My legs were burning trying to control my rhythm - and I'm a runner.  If you didn't time your steps right you got your legs moving too fast and literally couldn't control your legs.  The next obstacle was trenches, dug into the dirt, belly climbing through about 25 yards of gravel.  You had to belly / knee crawl.  My knees were bloody and ripped open after this, as were everyone else's who went through.  If you stood up, your head would be greeted by the barbed wire over your head.

From there, other obstacles included a balance beam 25 feet over the ground that freaked me out...it was LONG.  Something like 75 yards.  You know you're in for it when you encounter a obstacle station where they have six medics waiting.  The path wound back up the mountain into dark culvert pipes.  We had to climb up the pipes, which were barely large enough to fit in.  There was freezing cold water pouring down the pipes as we were coming up.  A the top of THAT hill was a 50 foot wall with only a knotted rope and little stubs in the wall to assist you over.  The back side of the wall was a horror show, I literally thought I was going to fall half way over when I lost my grip at one point. 

So by now I am about 2.3 miles in.  I have gone 2,500 feet straight up the mountain, all the way down and then about 2,000 feet BACK up again.  That was a treat.

There was a cargo net - spider web type thing strung over a box, which was suspended about 25 feet in the air.  You needed to climb to it and then make your way across it, and then figure a way down.  Another wall, this one easier to get up than the 50 foot wall, however the other side?  You used your body strength to find holes in the wall to lower yourself as far as you could to the ground before dropping.  The giant "slip and slide" led to a series tires to jump through, while other tires banged into you that had been suspended from the air.  I think that was about 25 yards long.  A giant cargo net - straight up - 40 feet and straight down - 40 feet.  And then the sprint to the finish.  Burning tires to jump over into the final "mud" crawl.  There are some other obstacles I am forgetting.  16 total obstacles in 3.1 miles.

This wasn't mud.  This was cement.  It was as deep as my waist and it was no joke. 

I finished at an one hour, seven minutes.  There were 4,500 runners and I was mid pack.  I finished around 2,300.  My buddy finished at 54 (I told him to go ahead of me at the 50 foot wall, I had trouble getting my grip on the rope at first).

My buddy has done the 13 mile Tough Mudder, the Spartan - a lot of really hard ones.  He said he knows the Warrior Dash's reputation and expected to finish in a half hour.  He never expected it to be as hard as it was.  He said it doesn't compare to the Spartan because...well...nothing does.  But he said it was very, very hard -- and he didn't expect it to be. 

Sign up for one and see how non Athletic they are! I am sure the Dash is easier in some locations than others.  When they have an actual mountain to work with, like they did in NH, all bets are off.


I'm kind of hooked, though.  The season is over for these up here, so I am signed up for two next year:

http://www.toughmountain.com/registration.asp   - July 2013

http://www.spartanrace.com/index.html  - August 2013

(http://www.newenglandskihistory.com/skiareaexpansions/NewHampshire/gunstock/gunstockmap-1985-0000a.jpg)

The race started taking path 7, straight to the top.  It then dipped off to 5 and 6, going down and back up.

There ARE "mud runs" where you wear dumb costumes and run for fun.  Where they have a beer keg every half mile and the "obstacles" are like running through tires or having a guy shoot you with paintballs. 

Then there are "serious ones" where you have to basically kill yourself to finish it.  Clearly, this wasn't one of the fun ones.

Congrats on finishing this.  Sounds like it was brutal.



Here's a video of an upcoming race in Florida.  I get the feeling this attracts mostly casual competitors and is nowhere near the level of what Maine described.

http://superheroscramble.com/

Sounds like fun.  Maybe it differs from location to location.  They also have zombie runs, where you run a path and zombie actors pop out of the woods and chase you.

^^ I have wanted to do that zombie one.  It sounds like fun.

They just announced the 2013 line up for that one!  Funny you said that, I am so doing that one too!

It's "Run For Your Life."

Good job, Maine!

Anyone locally wanna do the zombie run?

February 9 in Hialeah

http://runforyourlives.com/#!/infected-zones/02-09-2013/miami-florida (http://runforyourlives.com/#!/infected-zones/02-09-2013/miami-florida)

I'll be that guy since Brian pooped on MASH. I just don't see what excitement there is in running from fake zombies. If you are a runner, why not just run? If you aren't a runner, why do it?

from my perspective, "just running" can be boring.  Things like this make it a bit more interesting.  I run for exercise, but don't consider myself a runner.  Events like this are fun and good ways to get exercise.

I agree with Brian.

Let me ask you question, instead of going thru the hassle of Halloween, (decorating, costumes, trick or treating, etc.) why can't each parent just buy their own kid a bag of candy and be done with it?   

Thank you, Buddhagirl!  I was pretty okay with my time as my first one!  My buddy only finished :14 ahead of me and he has a lot more experience with these courses.


It's not just running.  Go to the web site and watch the videos.  These are 5k courses with obstacles which require strength, balance, will and endurance.  The theory I love about the Zombie run?

Think flag football - add about ten flags.  The Zombies are all going for your flags.  They don't stop.  So, sure - scale that wall and take a break.  If you want to have 27 zombies decend on you and steal all of your flags.  Me?  I am coming off that wall and running...and it's still not a promise I won't have a flag stolen.

It's running...and then some.  I run 3-4 days a week, I put in about 20 miles a week right now.  These obstacles courses add some "zing" to it.

I didn't realize they had flags as part of this. I just thought there were pointless zombies running around.

I have a good friend who loves those type races - he keeps trying to talk Brian into doing one with him

...and Brian SHOULD.

:)

Brian will, when he's less of a fat ass and might be able to finish it without dying.

He do you think Maine got less fat?  Magic?

C'mon, man!

I love magic.  Can you come wave your wand at me :o ;)

This thread has taken quite the turn...

I wonder, can running on a treadmill cause brain damage?

Only if you fall off...

Why would you ask that?  Did you hear that somewhere?

I just think my brain could be bouncing off my skull.  I have felt like that after running on the treadmill several times.

How would that be different from running on the street?

I'm no doctor but I'm pretty sure the skull has built in padding to prevent that.