Title: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: CF DolFan on November 09, 2012, 09:04:13 am Here's your chance to attack the greedy, angry, white man as the lay-offs have begun. Unfortunately though this is the new reality we are all forced to live with.
I had shared with you what my friend from Darden had warned and it looks like they are reducing hours to keep from paying more benefits. I would be willing to bet this will become more common. Locally some of our bigger developers in the county have told me they are closing up shop until things get better. They say they have been breaking even and carrying people but are being forced to close as their costs are going up. It doesn't make sense for them to wait until they lose money. I fear things are going to get much worse before they get better even if Obama comes out with a different plan. Quote BUSINESS HOW MANY BUSINESSES HAVE ANNOUNCED CLOSINGS OR LAYOFFS SINCE OBAMA WON A SECOND TERM? Posted on November 8, 2012 at 9:29pm by Mike Opelka Print »Email » Comments (365) Do elections have consequences? If you have been paying attention to the financial markets, you might think so. Wall Street has had two horrible days since President Obama won a second term. However, stock prices are not the only thing taking a hit. It appears that the job market is also suffering. In the last 48 hours, the following major corporations have announced layoffs in America (links take you to news stories about the layoffs – with details from the companies): • Energizer - The St. Louis-based company said Thursday that it expects to shed about 1,500 employees. When finished, the restructuring should lead to $200 million in pretax yearly savings, Energizer said. It aims to have most of its restructuring steps finished by the end of September 2014. • Westinghouse - Westinghouse Anniston, the contractor responsible for shutting down Anniston’s chemical weapons incinerator, has reduced its workforce by another 50 employees. • Research in Motion Limited - Research in Motion Ltd., the maker of BlackBerry smartphones, laid off about 200 people at its U.S. headquarters in Irving on Wednesday, according to a source close to the company who did not want to be named. • Lightyear Network Solutions - More than one dozen employees at a Pikeville company lost their jobs this week. Officials with Lightyear Network Solutions said they are consolidating offices in Louisville and Pikeville to save money. • Providence Journal - The Providence Journal Co. laid off 23 full-time workers Wednesday as part of a cost-cutting effort, including 16 members of the Providence Newspaper Guild and 7 non-union employees. • Hawker Beechcraft - The company says 240 employees will lose their jobs with the closing of Hawker Beechcraft Services facilities in Little Rock, Ark.; Mesa, Ariz.; and San Antonio, Texas. • Boeing (30% of their management staff) - Boeing Co. said Wednesday it plans to employ 30% fewer executives at its Boeing Defense, Space & Security unit by the end of 2012 compared to 2010 levels. • CVPH Medical Center - CVPH Medical Center has handed pink slips to 17 employees. The layoffs — nine in management and eight hourly staffers — are part of an effort to “help bolster the hospital’s financial position in 2013 and beyond,” a press release said. • US Cellular - The move will result in 980 job cuts at U.S. Cellular, with 640 in the Chicago area, according to a spokeswoman. The cuts are slightly under 12 percent of the approximately 8,400 total employees U.S. Cellular had at the end of the third quarter. • Momentive Performance Materials - About 150 workers at Sistersville’s Momentive Performance Materials plant will be temporarily laid off later this month, officials said this week. • Rocketdyne - About 100 employees at Pratt & Whitney Rocketdyne, most of whom work in the San Fernando Valley, were laid off Wednesday in response to dwindling government spending on space exploration, the company said. The layoffs were effective immediately, and 75 percent of them came at the facilities on Canoga and De Soto avenues, which employ about 1,100 people. The company has six sites across the Valley. • Brake Parts - The leader of an automotive parts plant in Lincoln County has told state officials that there are plans to lay off 75 workers starting in late December…The layoffs are expected to start Dec. 28 and continue in the first quarter of 2013 • Vestas Wind Systems - Vestas Wind Systems A/S (VWS) is seeking to sell a stake of as much as 20 percent and said it’s reducing headcount by 3,000 to raise the staff cuts by the biggest wind turbine maker to almost a third over two years. • Husqvarna - Husqvarna AB (HUSQB), the world’s biggest maker of powered garden tools, plans to cut about 600 jobs in a move that will save 220 million kronor ($33 million) a year by 2014. • Center for Hospice New York - The Center for Hospice and Palliative Care plans to temporarily lay off as many as 40 employees next year as it embarks on a major renovation of the inpatient unit at its Cheektowaga campus. • Bristol-Meyers - Bristol-Myers Squibb is following up its lackluster third-quarter results with almost 480 layoffs. As Pharmalot reports, the company notified the New Jersey government that it would scale back in Plainsboro, which means the cuts will hit its sales operations. • OCE North America - Trumbull printer- and scanning-equipment provider Oce North America, Inc. will lay off 135 workers in three Connecticut communities, including East Hartford, according to its notice with the state Labor Department. • Darden Restaurants - The company, which was among those who had received an Obamacare waiver in the past, is looking to limit workers to 28 hours per week. A full time employee that is required to have health insurance (lest the employer pay a fine) works 30 hours per week, as defined by the Obamacare law. • West Ridge Mine - In its statement, UtahAmerican Energy blames the Obama administration for instituting policies that will close down “204 American coal-fired power plants by 2014″ and for drastically reducing the market for coal. • United Blood Services Gulf - United Blood Services Gulf South region, the non-profit blood service provider for much of south Louisiana and Mississippi, will lay off approximately 10 percent of its workforce. It was a hard decision to make according to Susan Begnaud, Regional Center Director for the Gulf South region. A layoff is tough enough for employees to deal with, imagine hearing the crushing news that your office is shutting down just before Thanksgiving and Christmas… Here are some of the business closings that were announced in just the past two days: Caterpillar Inc. will close its plant in Owatonna Minn. Mount Pleasant’s Albrecht Sentry Foods The Target store at Manassas Mall Va. Millennium Academy in Wake Forest NC Target Closing Kissimmee FL Location The Andover Gift Shop in Andover MA Grand Union Family Markets Closing Storrs Location CT Movie Scene Milford Location NH Update: TE Connectivity Closing Greensboro Plant – 620 Layoffs Expected Gomer’s Fried Chicken in South Kansas City Kmart in Homer Glen Fresh Market on Pine Street in Burlington AGC Glass North America to permanently close its Blue Ridge Plant in Kingsport Tenn. The Target store at Platte and Academy in Colorado Springs The Roses store on Reynold Road in Winston-Salem NC Meanders Kitchen losing its West Seattle location at 6032 California Ave Bost Harley-Davidson at 46th Avenue North and Delaware Ave. in West Nashville TN Townsend Booksellers in Oakland The Kmart store in Parkway Plaza off University Drive in Durham NC – 79 Jobs Lost To see even more companies that announced layoffs since the election, visit the Daily Job Cuts page. This story has been updated. http://www.theblaze.com/stories/how-many-businesses-have-announced-closings-or-lay-offs-since-obama-won-a-second-term/ Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Fau Teixeira on November 09, 2012, 09:16:41 am I have a feeling that if romney had won, this list wouldn't have been very different.
On another note businesses that choose to close based purely on not wanting to offer health care coverage to their workers, are more than welcome to close, it just opens up an opportunity for a better business to come along and take their market share. Also, we should as a country have a 0% unemployment policy .. if people are out of work, we should hire them to perform needed infrastructure tasks. And before everyone complains that that's socialism, the republicans labelled obama as a socialist for 4 years and he still was re-elected. i would say that the majority of the american people approve of socialism. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: CF DolFan on November 09, 2012, 09:38:19 am I have a feeling that if romney had won, this list wouldn't have been very different. I can't speak for all but it's been common knowledge many companies were waiting until the elcetion. If Romney had won it was almost a given that Obama care would be repealed. That's a huge deal for small businesses but no one seems to be listening.On another note businesses that choose to close based purely on not wanting to offer health care coverage to their workers, are more than welcome to close, it just opens up an opportunity for a better business to come along and take their market share. Also, we should as a country have a 0% unemployment policy .. if people are out of work, we should hire them to perform needed infrastructure tasks. And before everyone complains that that's socialism, the republicans labelled obama as a socialist for 4 years and he still was re-elected. i would say that the majority of the american people approve of socialism. I think the majority of America "thinks" they want socialism. It's just like credit. Many Americans do not realize that spending someone else's money comes with consequences until it is too late. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Fau Teixeira on November 09, 2012, 09:53:53 am I can't speak for all but it's been common knowledge many companies were waiting until the elcetion. If Romney had won it was almost a given that Obama care would be repealed. That's a huge deal for small businesses but no one seems to be listening. I think the majority of America "thinks" they want socialism. It's just like credit. Many Americans does not realize that spending someone else's money comes with consequences until it is too late. small businesses (under 50 employees) are exempt from obamacare The problem with the concept of "spending someone else's money" is that in essence, it isn't someone else's money. Money is and has always been property of the people. It's not legal for you to melt down pennies for copper wire and it's not legal for your to burn a $100 bill. Conservatives are generally under the misconception that the government (the people) have no right to tax them. That isn't the case. By virtue of being an American, you are part of the government, like it or not, you or one of your ancestors agreed to a social contract. and not an implicit agreement either, but an active explicit agreement. If one of your ancestors immigrated to this country after the constitution was ratified, they affirmatively committed themselves and their descendants to the concept that the government can tax you in order to provide services for the general population. If your family was here before the revolution, then they had a choice to either participate in the drafting of a constitution, electing representatives to ratify it, or to return to the British empire. If you immigrated here (like i did) then that's an even more active choice and acceptance of how the country functions. As a result of this acquiescence Americans have an obligation to support the services that the people deem necessary. Obamacare is one of these services. At first, enacted by the representatives of the people, confirmed and upheld by the courts and ultimately re-validated by the people themselves this past election. Americans have proven over and over that they DO want a socialist system. Even the founders were in support of practical socialism by creating militias and an army (i'd argue the first implementation of socialist philosophy), even though the concept of socialism didn't exist at the time. America was a socialist country in 1776, was a socialist country in 1865 and remains a socialist country to this day. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: badger6 on November 09, 2012, 10:04:13 am I think the majority of America "thinks" they want socialism. It's just like credit. Many Americans does not realize that spending someone else's money comes with consequences until it is too late. See, that last part is the problem. Our economy is based on consumer debt and consumption when is should be based on saving and production. Although Bush did his damage. I guarantee, in 3-4 years when the shit really hits the fan, the same ones that voted for Obama and supported him so heavily, will still be blaming Bush. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: CF DolFan on November 09, 2012, 10:07:16 am That's your definition and semantics on top of that. It really doesn't matter what term you use to call a business with 51 or even 500 people if the expenses are more than the owner is able or even willing to lose.
Quote http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_business What constitutes a small business varies widely around the world. Small businesses are normally privately owned corporations, partnerships, or sole proprietorships. What constitutes "small" in terms of government support and tax policy varies by country and by industry, ranging from fewer than 15 employees under the Australian Fair Work Act 2009, 50 employees according to the definition used by the European Union, and fewer than 500 employees to qualify for many U.S. Small Business Administration programs, although in 2006 there were over 18,000 "small businesses" with over 500 employees that accounted for half of all the employees employed by all "small business ". [1] [2] Small businesses can also be classified according to other methods such as sales, assets, or net profits. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Phishfan on November 09, 2012, 10:15:59 am On the flip side, these companies are hiring.
1. AmerisourceBergen Industry: Pharmaceutical Sample job titles: Telehealth registered nurse, senior accountant, compensation analyst, physician account manager, pharmacy care coordinator Location: Chesterbrook, Pa.; Frisco, Texas; New York; Burlington, Mass.; Chicago 2. Cellular Sales Industry: Retail, wireless, telecommunications Sample job titles: Sales representative-cellular sales/Verizon Wireless Location: Alabama, Connecticut, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Mississippi, Missouri, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Vermont, Virginia, Washington 3. Crescent Processing Co. Industry: Banking/finance Sample job titles: Outside sales-financial services Location: Nationwide 4. Dixon Hughes Goodman LLP Industry: Public accounting Sample job titles: Audit associate, tax associate, financial adviser, tax manager, consultant Location: Virginia, North Carolina, Atlanta, Florida, Tennessee, Texas, West Virginia 5. Employer Flexible Industry: Information technology, administration, accounting, finance, manufacturing Sample job titles: Credit analyst, tax accountant, SharePoint architect, Oracle developer, engineering, manager, asset services manager Location: Texas 6. Higher One Industry: Financial services/banking Sample job titles: Information-technology business analyst, vice president of product management-marketing, software engineer-interface development, chief compliance officer, at home/seasonal customer service representative Location: New Haven, Conn.; Atlanta; Oakland, Calif. 7. Hilti Corp. Industry: Construction equipment Sample job titles: SAP business process consultant, IT infrastructure engineer, account manager Location: Nationwide 8. KeyPoint Government Solutions Industry: Investigation services Sample job titles: Vehicular crash investigator, polygraph examiner, counterintelligence instructor, background investigator Location: Nationwide 9. Level 3 Communications Industry: Telecommunications Sample job titles: Account director, network engineer, critical infrastructure facilities technician, software architect Location: Nationwide 10. Lutech Resources Industry: Oil and gas Sample job titles: Project engineer, invoice coordinator, safety manager, process engineer Location: Plainfield, Ill.; Houston; The Woodlands, Texas 11. Main Line Health Industry: Health care Sample job titles: Registered nurse, nurse case manager, physical therapist, director of quality Location: Bryn Mawr, Pa.; Media, Pa.; Paoli, Pa. 12. Multivision Industry: IT consulting Sample job titles: Computer operator, help desk, field service technician, Apple help desk, senior database architect, systems analyst Location: Minnesota, California, New York, Utah, Pennsylvania, Colorado 13. Quality Systems and NextGen Industry: Health care/medical records Sample job titles: Clinical applications support manager, interface analyst, sales director-regional, product manager-clinical content, clinical implementation specialist, implementation manager-financial, nursing product manager, director of clinical product management, director of financial product management, manager of clinical content management, manager of clinical product management Location: Irvine, Calif.; Horsham, Pa.; Atlanta; St. Louis; Austin, Texas; Hunt Valley, Md.; Dallas; Santa Ana, Calif. 14. Securitas Industry: Security services and technology Sample job titles: Security officer, business development manager, operations manager Location: Nationwide 15. Starkey Hearing Technologies Industry: Electromedical and electrotherapeutic apparatus manufacturing (consumer hearing aids) Sample job titles: Digital signal processing engineer, audiologist, firmware engineer, wireless engineer Location: Minneapolis; will pay to relocate workers for certain positions http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Article/MSN-3115-Job-Search-Companies-hiring-this-month/?SiteId=cbmsn43115&sc_extcmp=JS_3115_advice Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Landshark on November 09, 2012, 10:18:11 am I have two friends that own a contracting/solar panel installation business and after the election, the wife was crying and stating that they may have to shut it down.
Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Fau Teixeira on November 09, 2012, 10:18:40 am See, that last part is the problem. Our economy is based on consumer debt and consumption when is should be based on saving and production. Although Bush did his damage. I guarantee, in 3-4 years when the shit really hits the fan, the same ones that voted for Obama and supported him so heavily, will still be blaming Bush. I actually blame this most recent recession on Reagan, his deregulation of the banking industry is what started us on the path to this mess. On a tangent, i think 50 years from now, objective historians will regard Reagan as one of the worst presidents this country had in the 20th century from a domestic perspective. It's arguable that his only lasting successes were in the areas of foreign policy, but even then it's just arguable. and the WORST part is, the republicans in congress make Reagan look reasonable Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: badger6 on November 09, 2012, 10:25:25 am That's your definition and semantics on top of that. It really doesn't matter what term you use to call a business with 51 or even 500 people if the expenses are more than the owner is able or even willing to lose. Not sure how true they are, but I have read reports that a good percentage of companies will drop all insurance and just pay the $2000 per employee penalty. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: CF DolFan on November 09, 2012, 10:27:49 am I actually blame this most recent recession on Reagan, his deregulation of the banking industry is what started us on the path to this mess. That falls on our buddy Bill Clinton and yes I voted for him both times. He revised the CRA requiring banks to meet quotas for giving loans to low income people. He also increased the punishment for not doing so which forced banks to give out many unwarranted loans. My wife is a mortgage underwriter and this was big news when it happened in the business. The mortgage collapse is what got us to where we are today. His undying support for subprime lending created a wild race under Fannie and Freddie that we have yet to dig out of. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Fau Teixeira on November 09, 2012, 10:28:25 am Not sure how true they are, but I have read reports that a good percentage of companies will drop all insurance and just pay the $2000 per employee penalty. do you have a reference for these reports, or is this echo-chamber echoing ? Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: CF DolFan on November 09, 2012, 10:29:57 am echo-chamber echoing ? I just love when people get a hold of a buzz word. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Buddhagirl on November 09, 2012, 10:30:40 am Not sure how true they are, but I have read reports that a good percentage of companies will drop all insurance and just pay the $2000 per employee penalty. I would love a link to some of these reports. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: badger6 on November 09, 2012, 11:15:45 am Seems like math 101 to me. $2000 penalty per employee VS health insurance contribution. Which one you thinks saves money ?
do you have a reference for these reports, or is this echo-chamber echoing ? I would love a link to some of these reports. Really ? Sarcastic much ? Like I need to fucking lie about it. Been a few weeks since I read it but I have found a few articles for you. Anyhow, you libtards are the ones always complaining about the "sinister" free market and the "evil" companies and corporations. Do you really put it past a company to put their own financial interests in front of its employees well being ? http://money.cnn.com/2012/07/24/pf/health-coverage-employers/index.htm (http://money.cnn.com/2012/07/24/pf/health-coverage-employers/index.htm) http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/inside-politics/2012/jul/24/nearly-one-10-employers-drop-health-coverage/ (http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/inside-politics/2012/jul/24/nearly-one-10-employers-drop-health-coverage/) http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2012/jul/07/econometer-will-companies-drop-health-coverage-wak/ (http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2012/jul/07/econometer-will-companies-drop-health-coverage-wak/) http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390443437504577545770682810842.html (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390443437504577545770682810842.html) http://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/2012/05/01/fortune-100-survey-employers-could-save-422-billion-by-dropping-health-coverage/ (http://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/2012/05/01/fortune-100-survey-employers-could-save-422-billion-by-dropping-health-coverage/) Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Buddhagirl on November 09, 2012, 11:34:19 am Not sarcastic. I just want to read the reports.
I have a feeling that those business owners claiming to be hurt by Obama and needing to lay people off are full of it. Truly small companies do not have to worry about Obamacare. Period. The company I work for (boss + 3 employees) is not affected in anyway by Obamacare. Since we handle our own insurance, Obamacare will open up more options for us as individuals. My father is a small business owner and said he is in no way affected by Obamacare. He's actually expanding. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Spider-Dan on November 09, 2012, 12:10:19 pm Maybe we should return to the Bush-era free-market principles that resulted in millions of jobs being lost.
That falls on our buddy Bill Clinton and yes I voted for him both times. He revised the CRA requiring banks to meet quotas for giving loans to low income people. He also increased the punishment for not doing so which forced banks to give out many unwarranted loans. My wife is a mortgage underwriter and this was big news when it happened in the business. The mortgage collapse is what got us to where we are today. No, it is not. Every subprime loan in the US could have defaulted and it would have been a drop in the bucket compared to the >$60 trillion dollars in legalized bets placed on these loans via credit default swaps.The fact of the matter is that there were safeguards in place to prevent this sort of collapse from happening. Prior to GOP financial deregulation, every single subprime loan could have defaulted and it would have been nothing more than a blip. The collapse was caused by insurance companies participating in thinly-veiled gambling, where Party C takes out an insurance policy (otherwise known as a Credit Default Swap) on whether or not Party A will default on its loan from Party B. Yes, you read that right: a third-party is taking out insurance on another party's loan. This is like me taking out insurance on whether or not LeBron James gets in a car accident. Have you ever wondered why one of the biggest part of the TARP bailout was rescuing AIG... an insurance company? They don't make loans to homeowners, subprime or otherwise. But they do (and did) issue out these incredibly corrupt Credit Default Swaps... and when the home loans started failing, AIG was on the hook to pay out billions of dollars that they didn't have. That's what caused the collapse; not the homeowners (subprime or otherwise) defaulting on their mortgages, but the financial institutions that overleveraged themselves to insanity, resting on Credit Default Swaps as "backing" for their financial solvency. Once some loans started failing and it became clear that no one had the money to pay out the CDSes, the entire operation was exposed for the Ponzi scheme that it is. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: bsmooth on November 10, 2012, 12:58:03 am That falls on our buddy Bill Clinton and yes I voted for him both times. He revised the CRA requiring banks to meet quotas for giving loans to low income people. He also increased the punishment for not doing so which forced banks to give out many unwarranted loans. My wife is a mortgage underwriter and this was big news when it happened in the business. The mortgage collapse is what got us to where we are today. His undying support for subprime lending created a wild race under Fannie and Freddie that we have yet to dig out of. Actually the Federal Reserve did this in 1994 when they denied a merger between two banks based on the fact they were not carrying enough CRA type loans on their books. Of course you ignore the repeal of the Glass-Stegall Act which prevented investment banks and commercial banks from merging. Not one bank has ever gotten into trouble for denying a CRA loan. Also it has been shown that non CRA subprime loans made up the bulk of the loans that defaulted. But why look at all the factors that caused the meltdown, when it is easy to place the blame on the CRA and the Dems solely and ignore what the GOP did to make the problem worse too. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: dolphins4life on November 10, 2012, 10:16:01 am It was a tough call but I mean, I have a pre-existing condition, so do I want Obamacare to be repealed and have my own insurance go through the roof?
Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: badger6 on November 10, 2012, 10:56:13 am It was a tough call but I mean, I have a pre-existing condition, so do I want Obamacare to be repealed and have my own insurance go through the roof? I can assure you that all insurance is going through the roof before too long. If Obamacare was repealed it would have been replaced with some other type of legislation that would have more than likely had a pre existing clause included. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: dolphins4life on November 10, 2012, 01:21:43 pm I could fully be misunderstanding of this and I fully welcome any rebuttal, but it seems the way Obamacare works is this:
Group of People A = preexisting condition Group of People B = normal Before Obamacare: Group A = $800 a month for insurance Group B = $300 a month for insurance After Obamacare Both groups pay $550 Naturally, Group B, who are people who have comfy jobs and are not struggling, are going to be upset and say, "everybody's insurance is going through the roof." Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on November 10, 2012, 02:09:58 pm That is not quite how I understand it.
Group of People A = preexisting condition Group of People B = normal Before Obamacare: Group A = Group B = $300 a month for insurance Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: dolphins4life on November 10, 2012, 02:33:46 pm Hoodie, just out of curiosity, what party do you belong too?
And you may have a good point, however, my pre-existing conditions are ADHD and Asperger's, so I can get coverage. In MA, I am not discrimminated against, so I can get the $300 plan. However, if I lived in another state, it could jump to about $800 a month. That's why I used those numbers as a baseline. And you didn't complete your post with an after Obamacare part. That left me a little confused. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on November 10, 2012, 02:55:04 pm Hoodie, just out of curiosity, what party do you belong too? I belong to neither party. I am technically an independant voter. My registartion form has me as "unenrolled" allowing me to choose to participate in either the democratic or republican primary. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Phishfan on November 10, 2012, 02:58:38 pm I belong to neither party. I am technically an independant voter. My registartion form has me as "unenrolled" allowing me to choose to participate in either the democratic or republican primary. I wish we had that. Rarely does the person I want to come through the primaries (at least in the first waves) come through and I have no say about it. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: dolphins4life on November 10, 2012, 02:59:15 pm ^^^^
Same for me, actually. I do, however, welcome any rebuttal from any conservative on this board. Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: dolphins4life on November 10, 2012, 02:59:38 pm The arrows are meant to be for Hoodie's post, btw
Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: badger6 on November 10, 2012, 03:02:05 pm A small percentage of people may see a slight drop. Overall the majority of peoples premiums will go up on a continuous basis forever or until government insurance takes over. Talk to me in a few years and see if premiums under obamacare have not doubled or more from current levels.
Title: Re: How many businesses have announced closings or layoffs since Obama won a second Post by: Spider-Dan on November 10, 2012, 04:03:46 pm I can assure you that all insurance is going through the roof before too long. If Obamacare was repealed it would have been replaced with some other type of legislation that would have more than likely had a pre existing clause included. You cannot require coverage of pre-existing clauses without a mandate for everyone to be covered, or the insurance market will skyrocket virtually overnight. Up until ~2009, conservatives understood this quite well, which is why both Romneycare and the Republican-backed alternative to Hillarycare had individual mandates. A small percentage of people may see a slight drop. Overall the majority of peoples premiums will go up on a continuous basis forever or until government insurance takes over. Talk to me in a few years and see if premiums under obamacare have not doubled or more from current levels. Premiums were already going up "on a continuous basis forever" before Obamacare, and it was never claimed that Obamacare will somehow result in coverage costs across the board going down (in real dollars). The ACA was designed to dramatically reduce the coverage costs for people with pre-existing conditions (which it indisputably will), to reduce the medical costs for people with serious conditions (which would also be difficult to dispute), and to reduce the rate of healthcare cost inflation (which is much more fungible).Even if we went to single-payer, healthcare costs would increase, forever; healthcare does not cancel out inflation. The point of healthcare reform is to get the increasing costs under control. |