The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

Here's the full story: http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8692304/san-antonio-spurs-sit-4-top-5-scorers-vs-miami-heat

In short, the NBA only had 2 games on last night, so they were both propped up: Nationally televised with the pomp and circumstance that goes with it.  However, because the Spurs were ending a road trip, Coach Popavich decided to pull his guys and put his 4 highest scorers on the place back to San Antonio.

David Stern is pissed.  Not only was the arena pretty full last night, but they brought out Barkley and Reggie Miller and the rest of the big guns to put this on TV and the game, while close, was a boring turd.  He promised "serious sanctions for the Spurs."

I certainly understand David Stern's position;  In my opinion, what the Spurs did was bush league.  However, I don't really feel comfortable with the league dictating who should and should not play in games, regardless of the reason.  That creates a very slippery slope.  I don't have a problem with the league taking action, but only if that action is things like moving the Spurs out of the national spotlight when it comes to things like primetime games.

Thoughts?

Just ridiculous for Stern to say anything about this; especially since Pop has apparently done this in the past. Maybe don't schedule games five days in a row?

This is ridiculous for Stern to be saying anything about the way Pop coaches his team. Pop does this sort of "mass rest for the vets" a lot when the schedule gets thick.

Basically, to quote the character Hanover Fiste, from the movie "Heavy Metal"...

"Stern!?! He's nothing but a low-down, double-dealing, backstabbing, larcenous perverted worm! Hanging's too good for him... Burning's too good for him! He should be torn into little bitsy pieces and buried alive!"

I don't think choosing to rest your starters was bush league at all.  When you have such an exhausting road trip like the Spurs just had,  you gotta do what you gotta do, regardless of who you're up against. 

If Big Shot Stern does levy any fines or sanctions against the Spurs for this, Poppovich should pursue legal action against the league.  I'm so glad Stern is stepping down as commish after this season.

Poppovich, in my opinion, is losing sight of the ultimate goal.  If you think it's to win games, you're wrong.  It's to provide entertainment.

No you are wrong. Popovich is not there to provide entertainment. That is the role of the NBA in general. Popovich's personal role is most certainly to win games and championships. Do you honestly think in a performance review the Spur's owner would say, "Well we finished below .500 this year but you sure did provide some entertainment."?

The NBA needs to step back. Stern may not be the worst commish now thanks to the NHL but he only moved up one spot.

Stern is off of his damn rocker.....Pop has been known to do this for the past few seasons and it is the coach's right to decide who plays and who doesn't.

I agree that Stern is overstepping, but I think that Pop's reasoning is bad at this point in the season.  Sit vs Orlando.  Not against a televised prime game vs the defending champs when the NBA is counting on you to build their brand.

Why is his reasoning bad? He is trying to rest players and giving them the night off against the Heat gives them a couple days off in a row. Taking a night off in Orlando makes them play again the next day. I think you are looking at this from the wrong angle here completely Dave. The fact that the game against the Heat was on TV should not play any part in the decision. Resting his players and the best way to do so is his only responsibility.

No, "winning championships" is not the ultimate goal of NBA teams.  It is to provide entertainment.

For example, tanking getting game experience for your young players in order to get the #1 overall pick so you can draft Tim Duncan or Kevin Durant is the smart move if your goal is to win championships.   The NBA frowns upon and discourages such actions because it reflects poorly on the league as an entertainment medium.

As a fan, I am most entertained by my team winning championships...   If my coach has won multiple championships, and occasionally resting his older players en masse to break up tough parts of the schedule has been part of his process in winning those championships, then more power to him.

^ You're entertained by your team.  But the NBA is trying to draw fans of many teams to watch the HEAT/Spurs...not just fans of both teams.  Nobody wanted to watch that garbage last night.

^^^ And I don't believe that the TV watch-ability should ever be a coach's concern...

It shouldn't. If Stern was so adamant about a 100% Spurs lineup, then maybe he shouldn't have scheduled the Spurs to play 4 games in 5 days. They only lost by 5 anyway, so he has no argument.

He has no justification to fine them and legally he can't anyway. The Players Union wouldn't allow themselves to be dictated when and where their players are allowed to rest by a commissioner.

(http://cdn.wl.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Spurs.png)

^ BFD

It's not like it was a playoff game.  The HEAT have long roads trips to the West where they lose to Denver pretty much every year.  Whining about the schedule is pathetic.  It's a long season.  This isn't the playoffs yet.

Keep in mind the Spurs will have to take a 2 week road trip fairly soon when the San Antonio rodeo comes in town.

There's lots of reasons to shit on David Stern, and this is certainly one of them.  What a dumbass.

It's not whining, it's maneuvering over rough patches. They have played a lot of games in a short period of time and they are resting their aging players. It just so happens their older players are their stars.

If Stern's argument is that the Spurs threw in the towel, the game was tied with 22 seconds left, so that doesn't hold up at all. If his argument is that the fans were robbed of seeing the stars, too frigging bad. That is a coach's decision. James Dolan and Isiah Thomas absolutely killed the Knicks brand for over a decade, why didn't he interfere then? Between the scandals and ridiculous payrolls and signings, they were definitely not what was best for the league. What is so special about this instance?

I imagine the Spurs will pay this fine just to be done with it, but if they wanted to fight it, they would win. Stern has no argument. The game was down to the wire and Poppovich has a history and legitimate reason to rest his players.

$250k fine for the Spurs. Hardly significant for a team worth that much. Just shows what egomaniacal dick Stern is.

Oh, I definitely sense some whining but I don't feel it coming from the Spurs.

^ I don't know what you're referring to.

Mark Cuban has come out and said the fine is justified because the NBA's big revenue comes from it's TV contracts. He also said if he did that, the fine would be 10 times higher.

I understand his point of view and don't necessarily disagree with it, I disagree with Stern not coming right out and saying what Cuban is saying. The game was a nailbiter and he rests his stars en masse all the time, so just say "It was a nationally televised game and they want to see stars and I don't care if it makes your team better or worse, you have to play them on national tv".

He wouldn't please everyone by saying this, but it's more understandable.

I don't see what the Spurs doing as anything different than if when an NFL team has clinched their playoff berth week 16 and has the backup QB play week 17.  I might not like it as a fan (particularly if said QB is on my FF team and it is SB week), but it isn't up to the comish to micromanage a team's roster. 

First off, it's very hard to compare the NFL and the NBA.  The NFL markets its teams.  The NBA markets its players.  Nobody gives a crap about the HEAT.  They care about Lebron.  They want to see Lebron go up against Duncan.

Also, in the NFL, as well as the NBA, the concept of resting players for maintenance after you've clinched a spot is an understood concept by players.  Inexplicably doing so in the middle of the year all at once is not.

And let's be clear -- this wasn't about resting players.  This was Popavich giving Stern the finger.  He rested all his guys at once.  And by rested, I mean FLEW THEM HOME.  Who leaves 80% of the starting lineup at home for a game against the defending champs on National TV?  He did it to make a statement.

So what?  He rested his players at the end of a LONG road trip and to do the right thing (in his opinion) for this team.  Isn't that what he's paid specifically to do?  Sorry that TNT got screwed (not really) on their crappy telecast, but in the end, isn't it about the sport and not the short sighted interests of half-assed cable networks?  If the viewers of the game were actual fans, they would have stuck around anyway.

He's done this before in similar situations. It was a brutal road trip and his stars are all old guys. I am not saying that he didn't take joy in telling Stern to go screw himself, especially considering how the schedules lined up, but this wasn't out of the blue.

Wouldn't surprise me if he does this a few more times during the season.

The NBA loves to rig games without the obvious notion of rigging. The Heat had an obvious advantage going into that game. Which of course, would have been downplayed in the media (ESPN). It kind of reminds me of Maximus being wounded before his last fight against the emperor in Gladiator. The fans didn't know and wouldn't care. As long as they are entertained. The job of the coach is to win championships. Its the NBA's job to build the brand. The NBA messed up. They can't fine themselves or admit wrongdoing. Like cancelling trades for "basketball reasons". This was a joke.  If it was such a "marquee" game, why was it on a Thursday night?  Seriously, Stern and the NBA dropped the ball on this one. When you fine an organization for making a basketball decision, you lose credibility.

The NBA and people whining about who a coach determines should play and when. It defintiely has a sense of whining, while the Spurs (to my knowledge) simply made a decision and played a game with their mouths shut (no evidence of whining).

To an extent this is correct but it is not exactly true. If they are promiting the Saints game you and I both know you hear them say something like, "Watch Drew Brees and the New Orleans Saints take on ..." while showing individual players photos up on the screen. They both definitely do their share of player promition.

At the same time, this is a media driven issue. Remember when Peyton was seen "upset" on the sidelines when his team didn't go undefeated. The NFL stepped in and made week 17 "meaningful" by scheduling division games that week. If a coach can't determine who plays when, then why have coaches? Yes, there is the entertainment value. But the teams pay the players. And if the team that hired Pop doesn't have a problem, I don't have a problem.

Really? 

This commercial
http://video.search.yahoo.com/video/play?p=lewis+brady+commercial&tnr=21&vid=3c76460d06c9e046f0e8890267da28b5&turl=http%3A%2F%2Fts3.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DU.4704729465749530%26pid%3D15.1&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bing.com%2Fvideos%2Fwatch%2F%3Fq%3Dlewis%2Bbrady%2Bcommerical%26vid%3DD229F162A09DBC45EC0FD229F162A09DBC45EC0F%26docid%3D4704729465749530&sigr=13u5ohp0p&newfp=1&tit=Tom+Brady+player+safety&back=http%3A%2F%2Fsearch.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%3Fei%3DUTF-8%26p%3Dlewis%2Bbrady%2Bcommerical&sigb=1209jfbco
would be just as effective if the two main characters were Ryan Mallet and Josh Bynes. 

"This week Drew Brees and the New Orleans Saints take on Peyton Manning and Denver Broncos on Thursday Night"  Is marketing the players as much as the team.   

^ Yes, absolutely really.

It's one of the big changes credited to Stern. 

Teams like the Cowboys and Jets are always popular with the league and the media.  It's not because they have the elite players.

That is because those teams do a good job marketing themselves.  Dallas because of Landry and the whole "America's team"  Jets get more coverage 'cause they are in NYC and have fat mouth Rex.  It was the "league" it was the teams. 

If week 17 of 2007 you saw Jared Lorenzen and Matt Cassel take the field on Saturday night, NFL fans would have been pissed. 

I agree with this. The NHL tries to do the same thing, but it just doesn't have the broad appeal the NBA does. The NBA probably does this because they know half the fans watching are just front runners and cheer for whoever has a shoe deal, but that's just good business.

The Orlando Magic were on the map because they had Dwight Howard...even if the team was bad.  Now, nobody cares about the Magic, even if they have a good record.

The NBA is a superstar league.

You see people watch teams because they have players they like.  If those players leave, those people will watch that new team, instead.  It's much, much less common in the NFL.  I have season tix and the games we sell don't have a lot to do with which teams are good.  It's more about which players bring in eyes. 

When Philly sucked, people still wanted to see Iverson. 

It's just how the sport is setup. In Football, your favorite player doesn't play half the snaps. In baseball, they either only pitch once every 5 days or bat 4 times a game. In hockey, too many shift changes. In the NBA, they can be involved in almost every play.

I think that's why a lot of the fundamentals went away in the game for a bit. People only see the 29 points and showboating up the court. They choose not to see the 9 for 27 shooting, the 6 turnovers and the complete lack of effort on defense.

^ I don't disagree that this is the part of the reason why.

Also, it has to do with the fact that you can actually see the players' faces and get a feel for their personalities a little better.  No helmets covering them up.

And part of it is marketing.  The NBA markets their stars more than any other league.