Title: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: zypr on December 02, 2012, 04:34:55 pm Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? I know he is a rookie, but he has not impressed me thus far. His passes are not precise, his decisions are often questionable. Can someone please explain why Moore is not starting? Moore is a better passer, makes solid decisions, and led us last season to multiple wins. So why is Tannehill starting?
I am sure that Tannehill will be a good, possibly even a great quarterback eventually, but I feel that he should be holding the clip board this season as MOST rookie QB's do. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: tepop84 on December 02, 2012, 04:35:49 pm Ireland is a moron
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EDGECRUSHER on December 02, 2012, 05:05:48 pm He has no one to throw it to. He has good arm strength and for the most part, limits his mistakes, which is key as a rookie. This was a lost season anyway, so let him get 16 games under his belt to get the kinks out of the way and then give him some receivers in 2013.
A lot of his INT's were just forced throws because no one was open. With some learning under his belt, he will just throw those out of bounds or in the dirt instead of into a crowded area. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: masterfins on December 02, 2012, 05:07:34 pm Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? I know he is a rookie, but he has not impressed me thus far. His passes are not precise, his decisions are often questionable. Can someone please explain why Moore is not starting? Moore is a better passer, makes solid decisions, and led us last season to multiple wins. So why is Tannehill starting? I am sure that Tannehill will be a good, possibly even a great quarterback eventually, but I feel that he should be holding the clip board this season as MOST rookie QB's do. The 2012 Dolphins were not predicted to be/nor are they a playoff caliber team. Hence, it's a perfect time to start a rookie QB to get him experience. I don't believe most on this board are in "LOVE" with him to use your terminology, however they do recognize his potential and he is the most positive long term option this team has seen at the position in decades. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 02, 2012, 05:09:40 pm Stick around. You'll find that not EVERYONE loves him. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: masterfins on December 02, 2012, 05:13:46 pm ^^^ Why are you talking to yourself??
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 02, 2012, 05:15:33 pm Maybe Ireland should start drafting qb's and not rbs playing qb (pat white) or wr playing qb (tannehill) After last week's blow up thread with Badger, and this comment, I'm obviously not alone. -EK Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 02, 2012, 05:30:36 pm He has no one to throw it to. He has good arm strength and for the most part, limits his mistakes, which is key as a rookie. This was a lost season anyway, so let him get 16 games under his belt to get the kinks out of the way and then give him some receivers in 2013. A lot of his INT's were just forced throws because no one was open. With some learning under his belt, he will just throw those out of bounds or in the dirt instead of into a crowded area. Actually, a lot of his INTs were tipped balls- just like in college. The things he did great at A&M, he still does great. The things he did poorly there, he has not improved upon. -EK Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: zypr on December 02, 2012, 05:48:49 pm When I use the term "LOVE" what I am trying to say is that announcers, the analysts for the half time programs, and coaches seem to praise him. I feel badly for Moore because I really thought he deserved a shot. (Before anyone says that Tannehill WON the job, don't) He came from the same offensive scheme which gave him an edge. I don't HATE the guy like I want him to have a career ending injury or anything like that... from what I've seen I was more impressed with Moore. C'mon, Tannehill throws multiple interceptions and you still leave him in. (Weeks past) I am just frustrated and tired of waiting for a quality QB, Coach, and team. I keep hearing year AFTER year that this is a rebuilding season. How many seasons are we going to throw away as "rebuilding" seasons? Somebody please talk John Gruden into coming to Miami to coach. Chucky WE NEED YOU!
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MikeO on December 02, 2012, 05:54:53 pm I am sure that Tannehill will be a good, possibly even a great quarterback eventually, but I feel that he should be holding the clip board this season as MOST rookie QB's do. Who are THESE rookie QB's that hold clipboards these days? Please share Wilson Weeden Luck RGII Newton Flacco Ryan Gabbert Dalton Bradford Sanchez Who sits QB's? The only 2 that come to mind are Locker and Ponder. Ok, 2 sat as rookies for a bit. And almost everyone else starts. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Tenshot13 on December 02, 2012, 06:09:48 pm When I use the term "LOVE" what I am trying to say is that announcers, the analysts for the half time programs, and coaches seem to praise him. I feel badly for Moore because I really thought he deserved a shot. (Before anyone says that Tannehill WON the job, don't) He came from the same offensive scheme which gave him an edge. I don't HATE the guy like I want him to have a career ending injury or anything like that... from what I've seen I was more impressed with Moore. C'mon, Tannehill throws multiple interceptions and you still leave him in. (Weeks past) I am just frustrated and tired of waiting for a quality QB, Coach, and team. I keep hearing year AFTER year that this is a rebuilding season. How many seasons are we going to throw away as "rebuilding" seasons? Somebody please talk John Gruden into coming to Miami to coach. Chucky WE NEED YOU! Gruden? NO EFFING WAY!!!! Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: zypr on December 02, 2012, 06:12:16 pm Dang... it took someone long enough. I was wondering when I would get a response to that one! lol >:D
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: zypr on December 02, 2012, 06:14:24 pm Do we want Cam Cameron back? lol
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Landshark on December 02, 2012, 06:24:42 pm Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: zypr on December 02, 2012, 06:26:28 pm That was funny! C'mon Man!
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: badger6 on December 02, 2012, 07:46:37 pm After last week's blow up thread with Badger, and this comment, I'm obviously not alone. -EK Which blow up thread ? I see lots of them these days.... Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Dave Gray on December 02, 2012, 11:28:56 pm So why is Tannehill starting? I am sure that Tannehill will be a good, possibly even a great quarterback eventually, but I feel that he should be holding the clip board this season as MOST rookie QB's do. Because this isn't how the NFL works anymore. You gain more experience playing than by watching. The decision-makers feel that it's more important to get Tannehill experience than to get short term wins with Moore. And I don't think that Moore gives you anything more, anyway. I think that the two are comparable in their ability to "win today" and Tannehill has a brighter future. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: BigDaddyFin on December 02, 2012, 11:38:44 pm He's hands down better off playing this year than not. It's just more common in the NFL now. Even before, great quarterbacks wound up playing relatively quickly. Marino, Elway, and Montana all saw serious action their first year if not immediately.
In Tannehill's case it makes zero additional sense to sit him because: 1. He's running the same offense he was in college. 2. He only played two seasons worth of Quarterback in college, so even if you hold him out a year, he's not gaining much in terms of experience. 3. His arm is much better than Moore's Now that means you're going to have to live with some shit. The dude's got a couple holes in his game, some of which are his fault and some of which aren't. 1. Accuracy. He's had a few games this year where he came in under 50% completions. The big issue here is you waste a lot of downs. 2. He doesn't always take off at exactly the right time. You see him sense the pressure, he knows he wants to run, but he's still looking downfield and then a split second before he takes off, he either gets nailed or someone trips him up. 3. He doesn't make many plays downfield. (this one largely isn't his fault, but it's still a gaping hole in his game) Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: BigDaddyFin on December 02, 2012, 11:39:59 pm These are all things you can fix, but it's going to take more than a season to do it. Given an entire offseason, he should be really good.
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: mecadonzilla on December 03, 2012, 01:18:26 am What's the upside to staring Matt Moore now anyway?
Unless Tannehill is injured, he will be the starter next year and every year in the foreseeable future. He's got a lot to work on for sure, but the stuff he's got to work on isn't going to be learned on the sidelines. Moore will be gone next year, most likely, so why invest time in someone who wouldn't advance you significantly beyond where you are right now? Tanny is the future and the future is now. Matt Moore is just a name on a depth chart and will always be so until he retires. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 07:46:09 am One upside to having him sit is not taking hits like the two bonehead ones he took yesterday. He's not Arian Foster. If he doesn't learn to slide, his career may me short lived. The fact that he did it TWICE yesterday shows he obviously didn't learn from the first time. Let Moore show him how to slide (among other things- like it or not, Moore looked fantastic in relief for nearly a full game), and Tanne can learn. You guys are all convinced he's the future of the team- protect him better. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Brian Fein on December 03, 2012, 07:49:09 am The grumblings of the vocal minority are the ones that expect every pass to be perfect and 3 TD/0 INT games every Sunday.
These are the same people that "break the glass" to other fans, and cause good QB's to get run out of town. It happens to everyone. This is the Chad Henne path. Embrace the future, because this is it. Support your team, rather than root for failure so you can be "right." Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Brian Fein on December 03, 2012, 07:50:42 am One upside to having him sit is not taking hits like the two bonehead ones he took yesterday. He's not Arian Foster. If he doesn't learn to slide, his career may me short lived. The fact that he did it TWICE yesterday shows he obviously didn't learn from the first time. Let Moore show him how to slide (among other things- like it or not, Moore looked fantastic in relief for nearly a full game), and Tanne can learn. You guys are all convinced he's the future of the team- protect him better. -EK Both times he was trying to get a first down. He's a gamer, and playing like it. I'd rather see him try than slide 2 yards short of a first down on 3rd and 8. He didn't get hurt, and he put forth some effort. I like to see the team play with HEART for a change!Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: tepop84 on December 03, 2012, 07:52:20 am The grumblings of the vocal minority are the ones that expect every pass to be perfect and 3 TD/0 INT games every Sunday. Chad Henne is terrible and should have been run out of town a lot sooner than he was. These are the same people that "break the glass" to other fans, and cause good QB's to get run out of town. It happens to everyone. This is the Chad Henne path. Embrace the future, because this is it. Support your team, rather than root for failure so you can be "right." Are you really that clueless to think that people only complain because he doesn't have 3td/0 int games. He has 7td passes in 12 games. That is not QB of the future material. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Brian Fein on December 03, 2012, 07:53:13 am ^^ yup, just keep looking at box scores. That tells the whole story ::)
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: tepop84 on December 03, 2012, 07:57:31 am ^^ yup, just keep looking at box scores. That tells the whole story ::) Is he throwing for touchdowns that aren't being counted? I know last week he threw an INT. that was counted as a TD... Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Brian Fein on December 03, 2012, 08:13:05 am yup, he sure did, and throwing TD's is all there is, right?
Thanks for proving my point. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 09:25:42 am The box scores show less than 58% completions (27th in the league), 7 TDs (32nd in the league), and 12 INTs (10th most in the league). Speaking of Henne, he has MORE touchdown passes in 5 less games, and he got run out of town by some of the fans! So...why is everyone in love with Tanne again? -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Cathal on December 03, 2012, 09:29:46 am The box scores show less than 58% completions (27th in the league), 7 TDs (32nd in the league), and 12 INTs (10th most in the league). Speaking of Henne, he has MORE touchdown passes in 5 less games, and he got run out of town by some of the fans! So...why is everyone in love with Tanne again? -EK Man, this is just a tired game... How many passes have our guys dropped that him them right in the hands? Bess, Hartline, Clay, Fasano, Armstrong.... Maybe if we had Blackmon. It was obvious why he got run out of town, just look at his nick name. Now, you can blame Sparano for that, but, it is what it is. People recognize that a rookie with barely any college QB experience is doing quite well and he has potential. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MaineDolFan on December 03, 2012, 09:57:20 am My personal "jury" is still out on Tannehill.
I will say this, however. We can all agree Andrew Luck is "head and shoulders" better ~ yes? People talk about Luck as though he already has one foot into Canton as a rookie. I happen to agree, he looks great for a rookie. Let's break this down: Luck: 76.1 rating 3,596 yards passing 17 touchdowns 16 interceptions 9 fumbles Tannehill 72.3 rating 2,559 yards passing 7 downdowns 12 interceptions 5 fumbles I would dare say Luck, who is "head and shoulders" more talented than Tannehill also has a much better supporting cast around him in Indy, a better overall team. More weapons. The numbers are better. Do not mistake this, I would take Luck. I'm still a little ticked that Miami is never willing to make a Washington type deal and get a player like RGIII (that deal would have turned Miami's fortunes around on a dime). I'm not saying Luck = Tannehill. I am saying the kid is holding his own and doing it with a bunch of "weapons" who might not make the rosters of other teams. They sure as hell wouldn't be 1's and 2's. I was vocal about the Marshall trade (in support of it) at the time. Now I have to wonder. Luck's safety blanket this season has been Reggie Wayne. Indy went out of it's way to make sure he was back in the fold. 1,156 of 3,596 (to the tune of 88 catches) belong to Wayne. That doesn't make those yards any less legit, but it sure makes a rookie quarterback look a heck of a lot better to have a 34 year "been there, done that" safety vale hauling in almost 100 catches. Right? Tannehill has 2,559 passing yards with a bunch of "also runs." Where would those numbers be right now had Miami kept Marshall? I'm thinking they would easily be over 3,000. Again, my personal jury is still out on the kid. I also think Miami has sent him into a gun battle with a spoon this year...and he's still running around doing his best to stay alive. I, for one, will continue to see how he progresses. I would love to see how he does with an actual legit receiver on this team, with all due respect to Hartline, etc. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: dolfan13 on December 03, 2012, 10:10:28 am 100% agree with maine's post...
problem is, why is this gm still around? the personnel moves miami makes are always reactionary with no vision. they had no plan going into this offseason. sydney rice, ty hilton, pierre garcon, martellus bennett, all available... not like alfred morris played football 20 minutes north of your facility for 3 years or anything. hell i'd even say reggie wayne if you went after him right out the gate instead of chasing a fantasy in manning. maybe if you give ireland 10 years at this, he will accumulate enough talent to turn this into a .500 team. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 10:22:36 am Man, this is just a tired game... How many passes have our guys dropped that him them right in the hands? Bess, Hartline, Clay, Fasano, Armstrong.... Maybe if we had Blackmon. It was obvious why he got run out of town, just look at his nick name. Now, you can blame Sparano for that, but, it is what it is. People recognize that a rookie with barely any college QB experience is doing quite well and he has potential. How much longer is the "dropped passes" going to be used. Marshall was blamed for it and everyone else got a free pass. Now he's gone and it's the rest of the recievers. Dropped passes don't accout for the over-throws, under-throws, and flat misses tht Tanne makes regularly. Reread some of the game threads and see how often those are pointed out. -EK Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Sunstroke on December 03, 2012, 12:39:19 pm How much longer is the "dropped passes" going to be used. Maybe until the receivers quit dropping passes? Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 12:45:12 pm After this weekend, Miami is 18th in the league in dropped passes. QB's like Manning (both of them), Schaub, Cutler, RG3, Brady, Rodgers, Ryan, Brees, Luck, and Stafford ALL have the same number or more drops as Tannehill. They all have better numbers (even those two rookies) than Tannehill. The drops is not an excuse unless you're pretty high up on that list, and even those guys don't use it as one.
http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/tmleaders.asp?type=Receiving&range=NFL&rank=232 -EK Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Pappy13 on December 03, 2012, 01:10:02 pm The box scores show less than 58% completions (27th in the league), 7 TDs (32nd in the league), and 12 INTs (10th most in the league). Speaking of Henne, he has MORE touchdown passes in 5 less games, and he got run out of town by some of the fans! So...why is everyone in love with Tanne again? -EK Why would the Miami fans care what Henne did in JAX? Just curious. He was run out of town for what he did in Miami, is that really a tough concept to comprehend? The same can be said of Marshall. He left because his production in Miami wasn't much better than what Miami is getting out of Hartline and Bess this year. I couldn't care less what Marshall does in the PRO-BOWL, in Chicago or in Denver for that matter. All that I care about is what he did in Miami.Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 01:15:35 pm My comment was in response to Tepop saying how bad Henne is and how he deserved to be run out of town. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Pappy13 on December 03, 2012, 01:23:15 pm My comment was in response to Tepop saying how bad Henne is and how he deserved to be run out of town. -EK Then why did you compare what Henne is doing this year for Jax to what Tannehill is doing in Miami? It doesn't make any sense. If you want to compare the 2 players apples to apples, then compare what Henne did in his time in Miami to what Tannehill has done. And if you want to be really fair about it (apples to apples) compare what Henne did in Miami as a rookie to what Tannehill has done as a rookie, but of course that's impossible because Henne didn't do anything as a rookie in Miami, so it's not really a fair comparison either.Henne was given plenty of time to prove what he was capable of before everyone coming to the conclusion that he wasn't the future. It's totally possible that the same conclusion is made of Tannehill in time, but it's going to take time to come to that conclusion, few are ready to come to that conclusion now. You are certainly welcome to your opinion. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 01:45:18 pm I think you're making something out of nothing here. It's not illogical to point out that Henne is playing better NOW, and reasonably could be playing at the same level in Miami (with more talent) than he is in Jacksonville. If people can start entire threads dedicated to comparing Hartline to Marshall, one post comparing Henne to Tannehill is not out of bounds. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Brian Fein on December 03, 2012, 02:13:11 pm I am worried that Tannehill is heading down the same path as Henne.
Falling out of favor with the fans early in his career and never really getting the chance to develop. Fans are impatient and will start to root for him to fail. We'll be drafting another QB in three years because people have no patience for development. Personally, I have no patience for fans like that. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on December 03, 2012, 02:16:13 pm We'll be drafting another QB in three years because people have no patience for development. Three years is enough. Drafting a QB this year would be a lack of patience. If after 48 games he isn't developed, it is time to look anew. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: badger6 on December 03, 2012, 02:38:51 pm I am worried that Tannehill is heading down the same path as Henne. Falling out of favor with the fans early in his career and never really getting the chance to develop. Fans are impatient and will start to root for him to fail. We'll be drafting another QB in three years because people have no patience for development. Personally, I have no patience for fans like that. Henne's path was his own doing. And like you, I see Tannehill heading down that path also. I don't think that blaming fans for a QB not succeeding is realistic. Normally, if a QB can't show major progress after 3 years, he probably won't... Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 02:47:13 pm Agree. Fans don't run a team. If they did, more would have been done to get Manning in Miami, what with the fan billboards and websites and all. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Pappy13 on December 03, 2012, 03:09:09 pm It's not illogical to point out that Henne is playing better NOW, and reasonably could be playing at the same level in Miami (with more talent) than he is in Jacksonville. If you can assume that Henne would be playing better (with more talent) then wouldn't you also assume that Tannehill would also be playing better (with more talent)? It's illogical to compare how Henne would be playing (with more talent) to how Tannehill is playing (without more talent). That is not a fair comparison to make and that's what you did whether you realized it or not. A fair comparison is how Henne did with the same talent (essentially) that Tannehill has now. Tannehill has LESS to work with this year than Henne had last year because Henne had Marshall. If you actually compare Henne's stats last year with Tannehill's this year they are pretty equal and that's when Henne was a 4 year veteran and with Marshall to throw to. When you compare them that way (comparing apples to apples) it's understandable why people had seen enough of Henne and yet would like to see more from Tannehill. EDIT: After rereading your post, I'm wondering if you were insinuating that Miami has more talent than Jacksonville on offense? If you are, I'm gonna have to beg to differ. Jax has Maurice Jones-Drew, Cecil Shorts, Justin Blackmon, Mercedes Lewis and Laurent Robinson. I think that compares favorably with what Miami has at those positions. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Phishfan on December 03, 2012, 03:11:44 pm Agree. Fans don't run a team. If they did, more would have been done to get Manning in Miami, what with the fan billboards and websites and all. -EK And it would have been an absolute failure in doing so. Manning has been very clear that he did not want to play in Miami, with all the billboards, cameras following him, and stuff. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on December 03, 2012, 03:32:17 pm And it would have been an absolute failure in doing so. Manning has been very clear that he did not want to play in Miami, with all the billboards, cameras following him, and stuff. Also Manning wanted to go to a team that was one QB away from playoffs/superbowl in an easy division, not a team that had multiple holes and was in a division with an existing jugernaught. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 03:41:16 pm I'm not insinuating that, I'm flat saying it. With no MJD, Miami has more talent on that side of the ball than Jax. You don't honestly believe that Cecil Shorts, Justin Blackmon, and Rashad Jennings are better than Bush, Hartline, and Bess do you?
Phish- I agree, but my point was entirely that- fans have no business dictating who should play or get run out of town. -EK Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Pappy13 on December 03, 2012, 04:23:20 pm I'm not insinuating that, I'm flat saying it. With no MJD, Miami has more talent on that side of the ball than Jax. You don't honestly believe that Cecil Shorts, Justin Blackmon, and Rashad Jennings are better than Bush, Hartline, and Bess do you? It's close. Add in Mercedes Lewis and Laurent Robinson who I think could start for Miami, compared to Fasano and ??? and yes I do. With MJD it's not even close. One the BIGGEST issues with Miami is the lack of a pass catching TE.Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Sunstroke on December 03, 2012, 04:41:03 pm I'm not insinuating that, I'm flat saying it. With no MJD, Miami has more talent on that side of the ball than Jax. You don't honestly believe that Cecil Shorts, Justin Blackmon, and Rashad Jennings are better than Bush, Hartline, and Bess do you? If you left the RB comparison out and just made it Jacksonville's receivers vs Miami's, then Jacksonville would win hands-down. Blackmon and Shorts are head and shoulders better than anyone on Miami's current roster. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 04:41:46 pm With MJD you're right. But he's not playing. We agree to disagree on the rest of the talent. They're 2-10 as a team and offensively in the bottom 2 or 3 of almost eery category you can use to measure an offense. They're one of the few teams more inept than Miami offensively. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Sunstroke on December 03, 2012, 04:48:56 pm No argument about Jacksonville's ineptitude as a team...but if Miami and Jacksonville swapped receiving corps tomorrow, Miami's offense would improve and the Jags offense would be even more inept. There's no agreeing to disagree that a quarter is worth more than a dime... Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 05:25:23 pm No argument about Jacksonville's ineptitude as a team...but if Miami and Jacksonville swapped receiving corps tomorrow, Miami's offense would improve and the Jags offense would be even more inept. There's no agreeing to disagree that a quarter is worth more than a dime... And if their running backs switched teams (you know, the guys who catch a ton of balls, too, in a WCO), Jax's offense would improve and Miami's would be worse. -EK Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: tepop84 on December 03, 2012, 05:39:30 pm I think you're making something out of nothing here. It's not illogical to point out that Henne is playing better NOW, and reasonably could be playing at the same level in Miami (with more talent) than he is in Jacksonville. If people can start entire threads dedicated to comparing Hartline to Marshall, one post comparing Henne to Tannehill is not out of bounds. -EK Henne isn't playing a lot better now. He was 18-41 for 208 yds, with 1 int and a fumble last week. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Phishfan on December 03, 2012, 05:40:38 pm Blackmon really has not set the world on fire this year. He has some great potential but this year is a real disappointment. Arguing about his current season (minus two games) is silly.
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 03, 2012, 05:52:10 pm Henne isn't playing a lot better now. He was 18-41 for 208 yds, with 1 int and a fumble last week. This is my point exactly. Tannehill is doing nothing to "be in love" with. Henne isn't playing a lot better, and his numbers yesterday STILL were better than Tannehill's. Henne: 18-41 208 2 total TDs, 1 INT, 1 Fumble, Tannehill: 13-29 186 1 total TD, 0 INTs, 1 Fumble That's the whole point of this thread. Tannehill hasn't been any better than either of the guys he replaced (Moore/Henne), but some people are ga-ga over him. You can cite all of his "intangibles" and say how he's a leader or whatever, but so far, he's lost more games in the fourth quarter than he's won; he's near the bottom of the league in almost every meaningful stat; EVERY rookie drafted ahead OR behind him has a higher QB rating (even Brandon Weedon, and he's in Cleveland, where NFL players go to have their careers die), but somehow people think he's the future of the team? All year I've said it, and all year this board has berated and villified me for it, saying, "he's a rookie"; "He'll get better." Well, seems like the other rookies got better- even the ones who didn't have their college system handed to them in the pros- have passed him on the learning curve. The guy just isn't as good as some of you guys want him to be. Not coincidently, the national media is starting to see the chinks as well: "Dolphins Notebook: Rookie QB Ryan Tannehill battling accuracy issues" Dolphins rookie QB Ryan Tannehill won't want a 23-16 loss to the Patriots on Sunday on his personal highlight reel. Tannehill completed 13 of 29 passes for 186 passes with three sacks and a lost fumble. The eighth overall pick in April's draft did have a nifty 2-yard touchdown run in the third quarter, but it wasn't enough to overcome his numerous erratic throws. Three misses stick out: Overthrowing a wide-open WR Brian Hartline for a sure touchdown on a fly route, throwing behind RB Reggie Bush on a crossing route for a sure first down and underthrowing Hartline for a huge gain after he easily beat his defender over the top. Connecting on any of those misfires could have helped change the course of the game." http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/nfl-rapidreports/21244877/dolphins-notebook-rookie-qb-ryan-tannehill-battling-accuracy-issues Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MikeO on December 03, 2012, 06:13:49 pm Embrace the future, because this is it. Support your team, rather than root for failure so you can be "right." PREACH ON! Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MikeO on December 03, 2012, 06:17:44 pm Personally, I have no patience for fans like that. Most of those people "aren't" fans! Don't let them fool ya! Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MikeO on December 03, 2012, 06:19:46 pm There's no agreeing to disagree that a quarter is worth more than a dime... I love that line! :D Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: badger6 on December 03, 2012, 07:01:03 pm Embrace the future, because this is it. Support your team, rather than root for failure so you can be "right." PREACH ON! Yes, PREACH ON. But remember, that's the same silly shit we've been hearing since Marino retired. I root for my team every week, but at this point I'll call it like I see it. If your team is failing and you are blindly supporting the problems, you are rooting for failure. At the end of the day, my opinions of the dolphins has nothing to do with how they actually perform. However, how they perform has everything to do with my opinions. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MikeO on December 03, 2012, 07:28:07 pm Yes, PREACH ON. But remember, that's the same silly shit we've been hearing since Marino retired. I root for my team every week, but at this point I'll call it like I see it. If your team is failing and you are blindly supporting the problems, you are rooting for failure. At the end of the day, my opinions of the dolphins has nothing to do with how they actually perform. However, how they perform has everything to do with my opinions. The team isn't failing though. The expectations were set low coming into this year based on our talent level and having a rookie head coach and rookie QB, and in the eyes of many reasonable fans/reporters and such the expectations for the season have already been surpassed with 5 wins and a finish of probably 6-7 wins. For what this roster is, that is a "nice season" under a new coaching staff. A good first step! Nobody is being a blind homer but you must have patience and be level headed about things. Expecting a rookie QB with little help around him to put up numbers equal to Aaron Rodgers, Eli Manning, and Tom Brady is foolish. Calling a rookie QB a BUST at halftime of his Week 1 game is foolish. Ripping a QB for diving for a first down cause he is trying to win a game is foolish. You can be harsh, critical, and go after players and the team. But be realistic about it and be level headed about things. To rip everything, say everyone sucks, say the entire team sucks is just silly and those posts and people cannot be taken seriously. They are to be laughed at and mocked! Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: badger6 on December 03, 2012, 07:45:17 pm The team isn't failing though. The expectations were set low coming into this year based on our talent level and having a rookie head coach and rookie QB, and in the eyes of many reasonable fans/reporters and such the expectations for the season have already been surpassed with 5 wins and a finish of probably 6-7 wins. For what this roster is, that is a "nice season" under a new coaching staff. A good first step! Nobody is being a blind homer but you must have patience and be level headed about things. Expecting a rookie QB with little help around him to put up numbers equal to Aaron Rodgers, Eli Manning, and Tom Brady is foolish. Calling a rookie QB a BUST at halftime of his Week 1 game is foolish. Ripping a QB for diving for a first down cause he is trying to win a game is foolish. You can be harsh, critical, and go after players and the team. But be realistic about it and be level headed about things. To rip everything, say everyone sucks, say the entire team sucks is just silly and those posts and people cannot be taken seriously. They are to be laughed at and mocked! I agree with your post up until a point. Like I said, I'm gonna call it like I see it. But to say that someone should be laughed at and mocked is silly. It could be you or me being laughed at and mocked next time for having an opinion. Everyone here is entitled to their opinion. Why does everyone care so much what everyone else thinks ? Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MikeO on December 03, 2012, 07:54:14 pm I agree with your post up until a point. Like I said, I'm gonna call it like I see it. But to say that someone should be laughed at and mocked is silly. It could be you or me being laughed at and mocked next time for having an opinion. Everyone here is entitled to their opinion. Why does everyone care so much what everyone else thinks ? Like Sunstroke said..."There's no agreeing to disagree that a quarter is worth more than a dime..." Some things just aren't an "opinion"... its just spewing nonsense for the sake of spewing nonsense! But back to the original point, calling it like you see it is fine. As long as its fair. I got no problem ripping players. Hell I have ripped Jake Long and Reggie Bush this year. Both have under performed in my opinion and I wouldn't shed a tear of both are gone next year. I can back it up with stats, injuries, and contract demands vs our salary cap situation. You might not agree, which is fine but at least that is a logical debate we can have. To call for Philbin's head and call for Ross to hire Gruden or to call Tannehill a bust at halftime of Week 1 is just silly nonsense that can't be taken seriously. That can be laughed at and mocked in my opinion. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: tepop84 on December 03, 2012, 08:33:44 pm who is comparing tannehill to brady and rodgers, we are comparing him to below average nfl starters and he still isnt stacking up.
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 04, 2012, 08:01:12 am Absolutely. Below average would be a step up. He's near the bottom of the league in most meaningful statistical categories- including the biggest one, wins. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Dolphin-UK on December 04, 2012, 08:45:27 am Absolutely. Below average would be a step up. He's near the bottom of the league in most meaningful statistical categories- including the biggest one, wins. -EK Conscious that I am feeding the troll but here goes... I wasn't aware that Ryan Tannehill was representing him self in the league? Last time I checked "Wins" was a team stat? You know, team as in the 53 man roster, coaches, GM, practice squad etc You are cherry picking statistics to suit your argument. If you are going to say the "lack" of wins is on him, then by the same token you have to accept that he had his team within a shot of the wildcard this year until this weeks' loss. This is where you say the wins are in spite of him but it doesn't work like that. Not bad for a guy who's "terrible", a rookie and dealing with what is universally acknowledged (by actual experts paid for their opinion rather than armchair internet pundits such as yourself) as a roster which is lacking offensive talent to work with. In my view, the unfortunate thing here is that certain people insist on going ballistic as soon as you post something inflammatory, which you enjoy and you degrade the argument down to a slanging match. In doing so you avoid any logical debate and thus never have to account for your views. I can't decide if you are a genuine Dolphin fan or a Jet fan troll bitter at having to suffer from Sanchez and Tebow. You're entitled to your opinion but that fact that it is wrong just amuses me. Personally I haven't seen enough of RT to decide whether he's the future of the franchise yet but from what I have seen he has the oppurtunity to get there and this seasons' bumps in a team which was not expected to get very far at all will only serve him well moving forward. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 04, 2012, 08:50:01 am I agree with some of what you're saying, but hear me out- in a QB driven league, when you're expected to be an improvement over the guy you replaced, wins DO matter. Especially when given the opportunity to lead game winning drives late, he has struggled badly, turning the ball over in the fourth and costing games twice (or was it three times this year) against only one win. He had a penchant for doing the same thing in college, which shows he HASN'T grown. Surely, the talent he has in Miami is better than what he had at A & M?
FWIW, the "actual experts paid for their opinion" are starting to point out that his mistakes and lack of accuracy are catching up with him, and perhaps he's not as good as the "armchair internet pundits" here believe him to be. To clear up the "am I a Dolphin fan" point, I hate the Jets as a team, and have been a Fins fan for as long as I can remember watching football. I was born at Homestead, and they were my home team; always have been. I doubt every other person here can say that. When I was younger, I lived and died watching Marino and the Marks brothers, but as I got older, I did realize that it's OK to be more objective and less fanatical. I just don't get fans of teams who see them have a losing season year after year after year and still believe that there's a winning, talented product on the field. A reality check is in order for them. I watched RT play several college games because two friends of mine are A & M fans. I saw the good and the bad. I have believed from day one he was not good NFL QB material, and he hasn't done anything to change my mind. Honestly, he was handed the same system he had in college, which put him ahead of the curve for the rest of his rookie class and you can say whatever you want about his supporting cast, but I don't believe they're much better (if at all) than many of the other rookie QBs who are out-performing him and who had to start learning an NFL system from scratch, not knowing 80% of the offense before training camp even started. -EK Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Pappy13 on December 04, 2012, 09:48:34 am And if their running backs switched teams (you know, the guys who catch a ton of balls, too, in a WCO), Jax's offense would improve and Miami's would be worse. -EK I'm assuming you are talking about Bush who has caught 24 passes for a whopping 189 yards. He has contributed VERY little to Tannehill's production. At times he's been decent running the ball, but far too often this year he's actually hurt the offense with negative yardage plays. His average has been dropping every week since the first couple of games. Thomas is an OK back, he's certainly nothing to write home about. In my opinion Jax has more weapons than does Miami.Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 04, 2012, 09:53:25 am I don't find that Jennings and Owens are better than Bush and Thomas. That's just my opinion. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Dolphin-UK on December 04, 2012, 10:03:01 am You see that seems like a much more rational argument to me.
From my point of view though, regardless of what you perceive to be a lack of talent going in, the NFL is the NFL and how a player performs there is not necessarially dictated by the skill set he had when he entered. Yes he is making mistakes, he is a rookie and will do that, but by playing him now we let him take his knocks now and see if he learns. Every year concencus 1st round picks don't work out, and 2nd and 3rd rounders come to the fore. Even Alex Smith turned out to be servicable after being the first pick, struggling and then getting it together! If RT had a legit #1 wr which could take attention away from Bess and Hartline, they could get open more and he wouldn't have to force throws. He also doesn't have a solid TE that he can rely on as an outlet. If he had those things and was still playing the same then yeah, I'd probably agree with you, and you might be proven right when we get those type of assets at his disposal but personally I don't believe anyone should have formed an opinon about him YET because whilst what he did in college is an indicator, it's not the be all and end all. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: EKnight on December 04, 2012, 10:09:28 am No, it certainly isn't. But 3/4 of the way through the year, he should have improved in some of those things, and he hasn't. The knocks on him coming out of college were his accuracy, his tipped balls leading to turnovers (and turnovers in general really), and his inability to win games late. So far, I haven't seen him improve any of those things. -EK
Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Brian Fein on December 04, 2012, 10:24:58 am his inability to win games late. This is the one that concerns me the most. I stood down on roasting him after the Seattle game, though.Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: Pappy13 on December 04, 2012, 10:55:33 am I don't find that Jennings and Owens are better than Bush and Thomas. That's just my opinion. -EK They also have Parmele who's looked good in spots, but generally I agree with you, but it's not like Bush and Thomas make Tannehill look better. At least not enough to compensate for the better pass catchers that they have over what Miami has.Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: jimmythefinger on December 04, 2012, 05:28:01 pm I think Tannehill has the makings of an excellent QB. He stands in pocket under pressure with guys coming at him and delivers a good pass. You can't teach that. He is making some rookie mistakes and I can forgive some of that. He seems to have good vision. When there's a break down in the secondary he spots it quickly. Now if he could just deliver the ball correctly we might've had two more TDs.
Still, I haven't seen him do too good in the 2 Minute Drill, and you have to wonder if that's something he can learn or an innate talent. Elway, Marino, Peyton and Eli Manning -- seems like they came into the League good at the 2 Minute Drill. Tannehill -- well maybe not so good. And watching Andrew Luck and RG3 this week you have to wonder just how good Tannehill really is. Luck and RG3 are leading their teams to victories and the Fins are putzing out. Think Tannehill has potential. Then again, I don't think we ever got the most out of Chad Henne, either. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: JVides on December 04, 2012, 05:47:48 pm To the original question:
I am not in love with Tannehill. I dig the women folk. ;) However, I see potential in Tannehill to become a good, solid starter in this league. The pros: - He looks the part (size, speed, athleticism) - He has a solid to more than solid arm - He already has the coaching staff's confidence to audible (hinting at a solid mental make-up) The con: - He is currently 31st in NFL passer rating at 72.3 (7 TD, 12 INT) Fun fact worth considering: Troy Aikman's rookie rating was 55.7 (9 TD, 18 INT) Elway's was 54.9 (7 TD, 14 INT) Drew Brees' was 76.9 (17 TD, 16 INT) in his second year (he sat his first) Matthew Stafford's was 61.0 (13TD, 20 INT) Granted, a bunch of BAD QBs ALSO had similar struggles and ratings as rookies, which leads to my main point: IT. IS. TOO. SOON. TO. TELL. Title: Re: Why is everyone in LOVE with Tannehill? Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on December 04, 2012, 05:53:12 pm his numbers yesterday STILL were better than Tannehill's. Henne: 18-41 208 2 total TDs, 1 INT, 1 Fumble, Tannehill: 13-29 186 1 total TD, 0 INTs, 1 Fumble completetion % Henne 43.9% Tannehill 44.8% Yards per attempt Henne 5.07 Tannehill 6.41 Turnovers Henne 2 Tannehill 1 Yup Henne's numbers were better in all areas. |