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TDMMC Forums => Around the NFL => Topic started by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on January 02, 2014, 10:54:20 am



Title: Extra points.
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on January 02, 2014, 10:54:20 am
I agree with BB and MDS -- extra points which are automatic are pointless and boring. 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/01/02/belichick-thinks-extra-points-are-a-waste-of-time/

The article points out multiple ways to make them more interesting.  What do you think. 


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on January 02, 2014, 10:56:58 am
I like the 1 yard line idea the best. 


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Tenshot13 on January 02, 2014, 10:58:35 am
With all the changes being made to the NFL lately, I think eliminating the extra point would be a mistake.  I like the way things are now, with the option to go for 2 if need be.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on January 02, 2014, 10:59:21 am
One suggestion in the comments was instead of a 2 pt conversion, make it a 3 pt conversion to encourage more teams to "go for it."  I like that.    


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: el diablo on January 02, 2014, 11:39:17 am
Just what we need. One more reason to criticize a coaching decision.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Dave Gray on January 02, 2014, 11:48:01 am
If you were to move it to the 20, would you still allow 2 pt conversions from the 2?


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: MikeO on January 02, 2014, 11:51:27 am
If you were to move it to the 20, would you still allow 2 pt conversions from the 2?

That's what I would do. Would make the games in Nov and December more fun in bad weather. Long kick in bad weather or a 2 yard play for 2pts


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Sunstroke on January 02, 2014, 12:06:37 pm

Leave as-is. The extra point system isn't broken, so why try to fix it?



Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Tenshot13 on January 02, 2014, 12:24:23 pm
Leave as-is. The extra point system isn't broken, so why try to fix it?


Because Bill Belicheck said so and Roger Goodell grabs his ankles for the Pats.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Dave Gray on January 02, 2014, 12:29:27 pm
Leave as-is. The extra point system isn't broken, so why try to fix it?



I tend to agree with BB that it is broken.  Why even do plays that are essentially automatic?  It's a waste of everyone's time.  The same is true with the new kickoff rule.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on January 02, 2014, 02:43:31 pm
If you were to move it to the 20, would you still allow 2 pt conversions from the 2?

That would be one option. 


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: fyo on January 02, 2014, 06:33:08 pm
If you were to move it to the 20, would you still allow 2 pt conversions from the 2?

I think you need to move it further out. The improvement in kicking accuracy in the NFL has been borderline insane over the past 20 years and shows no sign of slowing.

Look at it another way. What do you want the percentage to be? 99%? 95%? 90%? Lower?

Set the percentage and then look at the distances you're talking about.

In the NFL this year there were 253 field goal attempts < 30 yards. 6 were missed (a third of those by Jay Feely). That's good for 97.6%. Between 30 and 39 there were 295 attempts. 22 were missed. That's 92.5%. And, as with the shorter kicks, the majority of those misses are due to a small group of kickers.

The NFL doesn't publish more detailed kicking stats than that (collated, anyway), so with just those numbers and knowing about what the curve looks like, the average of the two numbers seems a likely estimate for the 37 yards a field goal from the ball spotted at the 20 would correspond to.

And that's today. 5-10 years from now that number is almost certainly going to be significantly higher.

As for the influence of weather, I was actually able to dig up a nice article on that (pdf link (http://www.sloansportsconference.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/Going%20for%20Three%20Predicting%20the%20Likelihood%20of%20Field%20Goal%20Success%20with%20Logistic%20Regression.pdf)) and the conclusion (page 8) is that at 37 yards, the effect is minimal. Neither rain nor wind really do much with those short kicks. The biggest effect was actually with "cold" games, but even then the effect was very small.

In other words, the weather would have to be pretty exceptional to nudge the field goal percentage from 37 yards below 90+%.

Those numbers do support keeping the 2 pt conversion from the 2-yard-line, of course.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Guru-In-Vegas on January 03, 2014, 11:26:55 am
Watching the player who scored TD kick the PAT would be awesomeness x 100!  Do it for da lulz!!!


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on March 04, 2014, 10:45:35 am
That's what I would do. Would make the games in Nov and December more fun in bad weather. Long kick in bad weather or a 2 yard play for 2pts

NFL might give that a try this pre-season.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/03/03/nfl-may-experiment-with-longer-extra-points-in-the-preseason/


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Brian Fein on March 04, 2014, 10:51:04 am
^^ I actually would be very OK with this.  I like the idea of encouraging teams to go for 2.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: MikeO on March 04, 2014, 12:07:32 pm
^^ I actually would be very OK with this.  I like the idea of encouraging teams to go for 2.

Makes sense to go for 2 almost every time I think (at least early in the game). 43 yards, screw that. Go for 2!


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: dolphins4life on March 27, 2014, 12:54:49 pm
Well, now the NFL is experimenting with longer extra points during the preseason.

It will definitely make things more exciting, but is that a good thing?  Idk.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: masterfins on March 27, 2014, 03:39:13 pm
^^^ I'm not gonna get to excited about 20 yd PAT's.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Phishfan on March 27, 2014, 03:58:19 pm
^^^ The ball is being snapped from the 20, they will be more like 37 yards.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: dolphins4life on March 27, 2014, 05:01:29 pm
I don't like the idea of having an exciting last minute touchdown drive go to waste because extra points are no longer automatic


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Sunstroke on March 27, 2014, 05:32:58 pm

^^^ and I don't think any points in an NFL game should be automatic.



Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: dolphins4life on March 27, 2014, 05:34:16 pm
^^^^

Then it'd be best to eliminate the extra point imo


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Brian Fein on March 27, 2014, 05:41:28 pm
^^ No because then you also eliminate 2 point conversions and more games will be out of reach late.  As it is now any team down by 8 inside 2 minutes has a chance.

Any kicker these days that can't hit a 37 yarder easily shouldn't be a kicker.  Missing an extra point is deadly, and this will put more emphasis on it.

I like the move.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: MikeO on March 27, 2014, 05:59:24 pm
a 37 yard extra point in an outdoor northern city in December will make games more interesting. Lot more teams would be going for 2 in bad weather conditions.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: dolphins4life on March 27, 2014, 10:24:15 pm
idk, I don't like it.

It gives kickers too much influence in the game

I mean if you've worked so hard to drive down the field to score a touchdown, I don't like the idea of all that effort going in vain.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Tenshot13 on March 28, 2014, 06:58:35 am
I still think if it's not broke don't fix it. Too many rule changes lately.


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: AZ Fins Fan 55 on March 28, 2014, 11:22:09 am
I still think if it's not broke don't fix it. Too many rule changes lately.

My sentiments exactly.....


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: masterfins on March 28, 2014, 01:15:59 pm
I still think if it's not broke don't fix it. Too many rule changes lately.

+2


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: MyGodWearsAHoodie on March 28, 2014, 01:26:57 pm
I still think if it's not broke don't fix it. Too many rule changes lately.

Ruined the game when they introduced the forward pass. 


Title: Re: Extra points.
Post by: Tenshot13 on March 29, 2014, 01:57:39 am
Ruined the game when they introduced the forward pass. 
Poor argument. Saying the forward pass is equal to moving an extra point back is ridiculous.

The first I even heard about changing the extra point last season came from the Pats and BB, so it doesn't surprise me you're all for another rule change the Patriots are a part of.