The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/24451604/nfl-to-adopt-15-yard-penalty-for-use-of-racial-slur

If a ref hears a player use the "N-word" on the field, a 15 yard penalty might be coming. Rule could be passed next month at owners meeting

What's the penalty gonna be for fat momma jokes???

This is the worst rule change idea I've ever heard. Absolutely going too far.

What happens on the field (or in the locker room, for that matter) is not subject to public consumption.

This is going to open the door for Kim Jong Goodell to hand out more fines and suspensions

Is it that common or is this just PR bullshit? I imagine if a white person calls a black person the N Word, the ass whooping he would get from that guy is worse than the 15 yards. Not to mention, your own black teammates would want nothing to do with you.

Seems like they might as well give 15 yard penalties for rape too.

I find this very difficult to fairly legislate.

The N-Word is the most unique word in our language.  It is everything from a hateful slur, a descriptor, a filler word, a term of endearment, and a curse.  It varies with intent, who the speaker is, who it is directed towards, and who hears it?

Is it a blanket fine that gets 15 regardless of inflection or intent?  Are you leaving that up to the refs?

I don't think a black guy congratulating his own white teammate, saying "nice play, nigga" is the same thing as a white guy getting into his black opponent's head by calling him a "useless n*****".

And there are 50 variations between those two on the spectrum.  I think it best for the league not to try to legislate.

i'm ok with fining every single variation and intent .. it has no place in a professional setting .. end of story .. if you can't regulate your mouth on the field of play you don't deserve your paycheck

Please bash each other's heads in, but watch what you say!

I think that it's also going to have a disproportionate affect on black players that it's supposedly trying to protect.  It's more in their lexicon. 

Unless your Ritchie Incognito and your any honorary black person.

I don't see why this policy should be an issue at all.

Every place I have ever worked, the penalty would be substantially higher for such an offense  -- fired.

Always a bad argument I see time and time again.  The NFL isn't the same as the average workplace.

THAT is a bad argument I see time and time again.  Just because you play a kid's game for employment is not an excuse to do whatever you want. 

A kid's game?  Putting your body on the line everyday is a kid's game?  Poor way to try and debunk an argument.

Whether you want to admit it or not, the NFL is not, and never will be your average workplace.  It's basis is violence, pure and simple.  To tell a guy he has to violently crash into another human being, but make sure he doesn't say any meansie words is ridiculous.

Don't get me wrong, I don't condone racial slurs, but by making this rule, the NFL is opening another can of worms to a league that has already had too many regulations put on it recently.  The NFL is being ruined by these yearly rule additions, when frankly, it wasn't broken to begin with.

Soon they will implement the 10 yard penalty for "hurting the other guy's feelings".   

Yes it is a kids game.  Children play the game for free, in fact their parents pay fees so the kids can play this game.  Stop making it sound like NFL players are doing something noble -- the military, firefighters and cops put their life on the line everyday -- football players get paid millions to do what millions of children would gladly do for free. 

And ethnic slurs are not tolerated in today's military. 

Don't put words in my mouth. I never said it was noble and would never compare an NFL athlete to our military men and women, police or fire fighters. I was stating the FACT that these guys do put their bodies on the line everyday for a boat load of money and to entertain.  To say this is a children's game is beyond foolish. There is a huge difference between Pee Wee football and the NFL.  I expected a more cerebral argument from you, not this comparison to actual heroes to support your flimsy argument when that was never implied.  There really is no reason to even discuss this with you further.  We are never going to see eye to eye because I know the NFL is not and will never be like any other business, while you believe differently.

I don't agree.  I hear this word daily and I work in a professional setting.  It's all about context and tone.

^^ REALLY? Where do you work?

(Note: its rhetorical,  I know where you work, which is why I'm surprised)

Friends talk to each other colloquially.  I hear, "mah nigga" or "nigga please" all the time.  Granted, it's not when doing business or talking to the public or anything.  But this has been true wherever I've worked.

I have heard it a lot too, but not in a racist sense. Honestly, I don't think I have ever worked at a place where we have not threatened to rape one another on a daily basis. This goes from office settings, law firms or restaurants. Only the media gets appalled by this language.

So does this mean they won't be playing "My Nigga" in the stadiums?

My issue is how are they going to regulate this?  Is it only when a non black player calls a black player the n-word?  What if a black player calls another black players the word?  Isn't it racist to not allow a black man to use the n-word if they so choose?  Is it discriminatory that a black person can use the word, but another race cannot?

So a player is fined this year on the field for using a racial slur.  You can see any other penalty on the field as a fan via replay expect this unless you're a lip reader.  So we as a viewer have to take the word of the ref that said player made a racial slur, he names the player in front of tens of thousands of people for a 15 yard penalty.  Player will obviously refute the penalty, and claim he never said it.  Then it becomes a he said, she said.

Do you see what I mean by opening a can of worms?

You can't only punish white people for saying it or else it becomes only a white man's penalty. We would have players with DNA tests confirming they were a certain percentage of black so they could say it too.  Can we say this is the time frame the NFL started to die?

3 players standing in a group on the field, all wearing helmets.  How can you be sure which of the three players said the word?

A 15-yard penalty could be a game changer.

This is a terrible rule.

it's unsportsmanlike conduct ..  . .. if you say it and a referee hears/sees you say it .. then you get a penalty .. i don't know how hard it is to comprehend .. will it be missed some times .. of course .. as will holding calls .. but it's an entirely preventable penalty ....

The game should be decided by how the players play on the field, not what language they use.  Preventable - yes, but why bother?  Why care?  What players say to each other is no one's business, and shouldn't translate to yardage penalties.

If you want to fine players for using that word, then I am fine with that.  But I don't want to see any team line up on a critical 4th and 1, inside 2 minutes, and have their first-down run nullified by a "he said a naughty word" penalty.  That's ridiculous.

So if you and a friend are in the break room (or locker room) and you say it and nobody who is likely to get offended hears it, then you won't get punished.  However, if you did it in front of customers, clients ( or fans) you will be fired ( or get a 15 yards penalty)


Unlike pass interference, holding or other rules that are not bright line, this one is extremely avoidable.  With most other penalties a case can often be made the player was playing hard and went past a not so bright line.  With this one the offense is extremely obvious and extremely avoidable.  

fans cannot hear what conversations players have on the field.  Is that your argument?  Offending the customers?

If it is loud enough for a ref to hear it, it is possible for a fan in the front row to hear it or for it to be picked up by one of the on field mikes (granted the networks do a good job at editing that out, they should not have to) plus calling an opposing player a racial epathat is unsportsmakelike. 

Is your argument that the rule will sometimes be unenforceable?

No, my argument is that language imperceptible to 99.999% of people observing shouldn't affect the outcome of the game by way of the largest enforceable penalty in the game.

Trying to conduct the NFL and other professional sports to "normal" business practices is pretty absurd. If I disagree with a guy in a meeting and we get heated and I throw a punch or two I am fired. Not fined or suspended....fired. So should we start firing every athlete for throwing a punch at another athlete during the heat of battle or during practice?  ::)

If you make $500k+ per year at your job and you throw "a punch or two," you probably are not fired, depending on who you threw the punch at.

While in general where the NFL has rules that match society at large, in almost every instance the punishment is lighter.  The NFL does not allow illegal drug use or other off field illegal activity, with most employers you would be fired first offense, with the NFL you get multiple chances. 

I don't have a problem with not every NFL player being fired for getting into a fight, but most of the time there is some punishment (granted running laps is much less of a punishment than being fired).  But a 15 yard penalty is pretty minor when compared to being fired too. 

I do have a problem with the boss (GM) suggesting that employees handle their differences thru fighting regardless of the work setting. 

So we only hold these guys to the "standard" business practices when it supports your argument? On one hand you are stating it is black or white on the other you are allowing a grey area........

A 15 yard penalty is ridiculous.....you want to fine them or make them run laps....ok by me...... a penalty is ludicrous!!!!

Actually there really is no reason to even make this a separate rule. 

The act of calling someone a n***** is unsportsmanlike conduct by its very nature. 

Yes, if used aggressively.
The same as if someone says motherfucker to another person.

But both of these can be used in normal conversation in a way that a majority of these individuals wouldn't consider offensive.

Of course....the NFL rules don't have enough rules which require a judgment call by the refs, we would be better off with a rule in which the ref doesn't just have to determine if the word was used and by whom but also must determine the intent of the speaker, that rule would be much easier to administrate and less prone to error than one in which the word is banned entirely regardless of the intent of the speaker.   :o

Honestly, I bet I'm not going to see this called all year (if adopted). I bet the word gets thrown around a lot in various connotations, but I'm just guessing I'll never see it called.

I will agree it will rarely be called but for a different reason.  Any player that gets this called on him is going to get serious ire from the coach, it is one thing to draw a flag on PI and say you were just playing aggressively, giving up 15 yards because of this is going to be inexcusable and is likely to get you benched.   

Sorry, I think Hoodie is way off base here.  This is sports, not corporate America.

There are some places where the similarities end.  These guys train too hard and work to hard to have the game hinged on a slip of the tongue for a word that they may use on a daily bases, even when talking to teammates and friends. 

I personally believe the league is trying to create a nice face in front of the press in light of recent events, and this is a typical overreaction.

As I said, I'm fine with discipline, but it shouldn't be translated into performance-related punishment on the field during the game.

If you want to make a rule emphasis on aggressive profanity (including the N-word) as part of unsportsmanlike conduct, I'm OK with that.

But to specifically make a blanket N-word penalty seems like an over-legislation.

I would support expending it to ban MotherF***er etc. 

^ Isn't this already covered under Unsportsmanlike Conduct?

Remind me. Why are we worried that roided and juiced up meat heads that play "A GAME" call each other names? I doubt that they care as much as the PC crowd does. Oh, the "N" word, so scary. Let's push the agenda a bit more.

Could the pro use of the word n***** please explain the benefits of allowing the use of this word.  Not just I hate the PC crowd or it has always been that way, but how players calling each other n***** actually enhances your game day experience. 

I can understand how there is two sides to PI, roughing the passer, more or less replay, but I fail to understand how anyone's game time experience is enhanced by players calling each other n*****.   

Who here is arguing that the game is enhanced by use of the n-word?  I haven't seen that once.  Methinks you may be misunderstanding the discussion...

If you are referring to my post, here goes. I am not "pro use" of the word. However, I'm not explicitly against it either. I don't think it benefits mine or anyone else game day, but I don't see how it impacts it negatively either. If it is said on the field, you or I never hear it. If a sissy NFL player like Martin gets his feeling hurt, fuck em. They don't deserve the overpaid salary and job if that's the case. As it is, we have too many silly rules in the NFL and too many silly rules in the country in general.

On a side note, I also don't find any other word offensive. You see, no word is any worse than any other word. They are just sounds to convey a meaning. Using, saying, or typing  the abbreviation "N word", "n*****", or any other of that silliness is no different than using, saying, or typing n*****. We all know what you mean and the word instantly pops in our head anyhow. So you tell me what's the difference?

I will try to answer your question.  I don't think there is a benefit to allowing it, so much as there is a cost to disallowing it.  I think this might be a solution looking for a problem.

Rules or regulations for the sake of adding new rules and regulations hurts things, in general.  Every rule or regulation you add, whether in sports or in business, has positives and negatives.  So you have to weigh the cost/benefit of each decision.  In general, I think the best course of action is no action unless the benefits of such a change clearly are greater than the costs.  I don't feel that this criteria is being met in this case.

^^ The benefit is PR glory similar to the "benefit" the NBA got by instituting a dress code.  It doesn't affect anything on the court but makes them look nice.

This is a step by the NFL to try to "eliminate" an offensive word from everyday usage by its players.  Bravo!  But penalizing for it on the field would be the equivalent of the NBA awarding free throws because a player didn't dress properly entering the stadium.  Completely irrelevant.

I would like to know how they would penalize the n-word but still allow profanity.

Unless they are planning on also prohibiting profanity on the field?

The same way that they would penalize it, but Goodell has publically stated that the name "Redskin" is represents "a positive meaning distinct from any disparagement that could be viewed in some other context." -EK

I still think the more people focus on the word the more power it has. The more you illiminate it the more it becomes taboo. That's exactly why today's youth are using it. It doesn't hold the same power as it did to the generations before.

Someone said how the term kyke isn't even used any longer and it used to be a huge racist term. For that matter hooligan and vandal were once derogatory terms for filthy, nasty drunken Irish and disgusting Germans. Words only have power if you let them and we give way too much power to that word.

IF this becomes a rule this might one of those rules they enforce in the preseason but when the season starts everyone sorta forgets about and you see called in very rare circumstances