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TDMMC Forums => Anti-Fins Chat => Topic started by: Dave Gray on October 19, 2014, 09:14:48 pm



Title: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Dave Gray on October 19, 2014, 09:14:48 pm
I am concerned with Philbin's (or Lazor's ?) game-management.  Twice today, we seem to have poorly handled our situation -- at the end of the half and again at the end of the game.  Both cases probably wouldn't have mattered or made a difference, but we're just making things harder for ourselves or removing opportunities.  Over the course of a season, this could be the difference in a win/loss.  (In fact, the GB loss might've been one of these already.)

Situation one:
Just before the first half ends, we're in FG range.  Tanny takes a sack.  We're at about the 40 yard line.  We intentionally commit a delay of game and then punt from the 45 with 5 seconds left. 

This is dumb.  First off, you have to make sure your QB knows not to take a sack with seconds left in the half.  Secondly, even after the sack, the correct play is to call a timeout with one second left on the clock and take a shot to the endzone.  You might get a TD.  You might get a pass interference.  You might get a hold, bringing you 10 yards closer and letting you kick a FG.  We gave away an opportunity for points, even if a slim one.  On top of what you give up, lots can go wrong during a punt, but very little can go wrong in a hail mary to the endzone.  Even if you screw up and leave time on the clock, Chicago has mere seconds to go 60 yards....they'd have just downed the ball.

Situation two:
Ending the game, trying to run out the clock.  3rd and 1 at the one with about 2:20 left.  Incomplete pass.  4th down -- FG to go up 13.

This is also dumb.  The correct play is to run on 3rd and 1.  Even if you're stopped, you run down to the 2 minute warning.   ...and then you RUN again on 4th and 1.  You do this for a few reasons.  Time is your ally here...not points, first off.  The difference between 10 and 13 points is essentially the same with such little time remaining.  So, if you get the TD, the game is over.  But even if you're stopped twice, you burn a LOT of clock and the Bears still need two scores, starting at their own 1 yard line with about 1:30 left.

None of this ultimately matters, but our time management and situational coaching seems to be pretty poor.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Tenshot13 on October 19, 2014, 09:32:16 pm
I agree with your assessments. The only argument for the second part is if they stop you on 4th down the other team gets a momentum swing. Flimsy argument though.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: dolphins4life on October 19, 2014, 09:42:05 pm
I prefer to make a two touchdown game instead.

The first part was right on


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: DZA on October 19, 2014, 11:03:24 pm
agreed. Philbin game management sux


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Phishfan on October 20, 2014, 09:26:04 am
Things like this have been an issue through Philbin's tenure. I'm just not sold on his as a leader.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: dolphins4life on October 20, 2014, 11:00:26 am
Can you win a Super Bowl with an incompetent coach?  I know of a team that has won a world series with an incompetent manager (2001 Diamondbacks).  Can't think of a football team that has won a Super Bowl with a bad coach


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Dave Gray on October 20, 2014, 11:15:01 am
I'm not here to shit on Philbin, because I think he does some good things.  Overall, his approach to the game is sound.  I just think that time/situational management is getting away from him.  3 consecutive halves of flubbing your situation and not making the most of your opportunities certainly is troubling me.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Spider-Dan on October 20, 2014, 11:26:57 am
Philbin's game-management skills evoke memories of the great Andy Reid.  He would do well to hire someone specifically to tell him how to manage the clock, because he's been clueless way too many times.

I don't know that I would consider Mike McCarthy a paragon of great coaching, but he has a ring.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Phishfan on October 20, 2014, 12:35:40 pm
Can you win a Super Bowl with an incompetent coach?  I know of a team that has won a world series with an incompetent manager (2001 Diamondbacks).  Can't think of a football team that has won a Super Bowl with a bad coach

Dallas Cowboys under Barry Switzer


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Rich on October 20, 2014, 12:57:35 pm
Can't think of a football team that has won a Super Bowl with a bad coach

Brian Billick and the Baltimore Ravens.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: masterfins on October 20, 2014, 02:41:01 pm
I agree with the OP for the most part, Philbin is still making rookie head coach mistakes; which he shouldn't be at this point.  Tannehill didn't help him by throwing it away last week when he should have taken the sack, then taking the sack this week when he should have thrown it away.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: JGreenMachine on October 20, 2014, 02:50:37 pm
Can you win a Super Bowl with an incompetent coach?  I know of a team that has won a world series with an incompetent manager (2001 Diamondbacks).  Can't think of a football team that has won a Super Bowl with a bad coach

The 85 Bears under Mike Ditka


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: fyo on October 20, 2014, 04:19:12 pm
Tannehill didn't help him by throwing it away last week when he should have taken the sack, then taking the sack this week when he should have thrown it away.

People keep pointing this out and I initially thought the same, but it you look at the play again, it develops quickly and Tannehill never gets outside the tackles. Trying to throw the ball at a teammates feet while back-peddling and getting the ball past three guys is a recipe for disaster. Better to take the sack than risk a dumb throw.

IMHO, calling for a straight drop in a situation like this is the first mistake. There's just no reason for it.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Spider-Dan on October 20, 2014, 05:01:22 pm
Tannehill didn't help him by throwing it away last week when he should have taken the sack, then taking the sack this week when he should have thrown it away.
Your criticism falls neatly under the category of "bad coaching."


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: masterfins on October 20, 2014, 06:18:35 pm
Your criticism falls neatly under the category of "bad coaching."

Perhaps. However IF Tannehill was repatedly coached about what to do in these types of situations, then its on the QB.  We don't know what coaching has, or hasn't happened.  Furthermore, at some point your QB needs to be able to do the right thing instinctively, which is what Tannehill needs to be doing in his third season.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: Spider-Dan on October 20, 2014, 07:38:42 pm
I mean, there's a difference between being unable to, say, execute a throw, and simply not knowing what to do.  The latter is 100% coaching.

In key clock situations, the coaches should be reemphasizing to Tanny "do not take a sack, throw the ball away" or "do not throw the ball away, just go down if you have to."  That is coaching, pure and simple.


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: fyo on October 21, 2014, 06:16:48 am
In key clock situations, the coaches should be reemphasizing to Tanny "do not take a sack, throw the ball away" or "do not throw the ball away, just go down if you have to."  That is coaching, pure and simple.

It would help if the play called for a roll-out and not a straight drop-back. On the second sack (the one that took us completely out of fg range), Tannehill was still between the tackles with THREE defenders through. No way to scramble and you really didn't see the play if you think he could have safely thrown it away (without getting an intentional grounding penalty).


Title: Re: Concerns about game management.
Post by: masterfins on October 27, 2014, 11:31:23 am
Another item popped up for me at this week's Jax game.  Early 4th quarter (I think 10+ min. on the clock), Miami 1st and goal at the Jax 5 yard line, up by 18 pts.  Why not run the ball three times and start eating up the clock??  Miller was doing well at this point, so why not start using the clock??  At worst you get stuffed three times, kick a FG, and are up 21 pts.  Instead Tanny throws an interception.  Sure 21 pts aren't insurmountable, but they would have burned a couple minutes off the clock also; not to mention they weren't playing against a Brady, Manning, or Rodgers.