The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

The other day the talentless hack named Stephen A. had some harsh criticism of Mike McDaniel's handling of Tua last year.

Thoughts?

I put it in this forum because it's more of a media related question as opposed to the Dolphins. Move if needed.

Fair question.  Thanks for posting.  I will move it since I do think that it's probably more related to those who are interested in the Dolphins.

While we're on it, can you link to the harsh criticisms or quote it?  I'm unfamiliar with the story.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSIQc0aLO58&t=1s&ab_channel=BarryCunningham (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSIQc0aLO58&t=1s&ab_channel=BarryCunningham)

I watched the first 30 seconds.

No, Stephen A. is often a bozo.  And again here, he is a bozo.

Whenever anyone says "I don't care what anyone says," as part of their discussion, you should throw out their comments.  Neither Stephen A. nor McDaniel are qualified to make medical decisions.  That's for team doctors/ league doctors.

It doesn't mean that the doctors are always right.  But Stephen A. isn't qualified to have a medical opinion.  And he isn't even challenging it medically.  He's asking someone else with no grounds for a medical opinion (McDaniel) to overrule the doctors.  I don't take his argument in good faith.  If he wants to have a doctor on his show to challenge the medical opinion, fine.  He isn't.  But even if he was, the beef should be with the team and league doctors and not with McDaniel.

It's just a bozo take, all around.

Funny timing this.

Here in Australia in the AFL last week, we had a star player for a team competing to be in the top two appear to be knocked out in a head clash (along with his teammate), go back to the bench, not undergo a proper concussion protocol and go back out on the field about 6 minutes later. Both went down with a reflex action which immediately reminded me of Tua's concussion against the Bengals - then they sent him out again after what already appeared to be a serious head trauma. The team was fined $100,000 (a record for AFL) for not looking after the player.

https://7news.com.au/video/sport/afl/showdown-rocked-by-sickening-head-clash-between-lachie-jones-and-aliir-aliir-bc-6332077296112

The sporting world has changed. Yes these guys are well paid, but there is a duty of care that should be there long after they have retired. The owners (or the governors of the leagues, who ever is running and profiteering from these blood sports) should know this by now. Be prepared to pay a lot for the brain damaged and crippled, and for a long time ahead. If you're not prepared for that, look after them right now, expand the benches and have proper head injury protocols.

Stephen A is a turd and his job is to get attention.  It worked.

At the time Tua played the Cincinnati game, it was stated that he DID NOT have a concussion.  Stephen A can say what he wants, but that's what team doctors said at the time.  The fact he got rag-tossed (and no penalty was called) by a Cinci lineman had nothing to do with anything.

Remember, he came back in the second half of the Buffalo game.  For this dude to criticize a head coach of any team for listening to his team's physicians, is absolute garbage.  Is McDaniel supposed to say "I know you have decades of medical pedigree but I think you're wrong and he has a concussion so I'm going to sit him."  Get out of here.

What the physicians don't take into account, and why so many players end up with CTE down the road despite never having suffered a concussion is shots to the head that DON'T cause concussions.   And those happen more often than you think.   

There are so many players who had their "bells rung" at junior levels and went out back on the field... and there are a lot of guys playing my chosen sport here (AFL) who I genuinely fear for in 10-20 years with CTE injuries yet to be diagnosed (but I already suspect are coming). All professional leagues should be genuinely shitting broken glass about trying to compensate players who wind up with serious brain injuries. Not now, not tomorrow, but Mike Webster/Junior Seau-like in 10-20 years time when they have 24 hour a day headaches, paranoid and are suicidal. The NFL have have seen it already... it's not like it's exactly new.  

Completely agree - however....
What I saw Stephen A specifically comment on was McDaniel "allowing" Tua to play after having a concussion.

According to team doctors, Tua did not have a concussion.  Thus Stephen A's comment is moot and absurdly foolish (just like everything else he says).

I'm all for stronger protocols.  I don't want these guys out there with crippling CTE.

It's just that I'm against putting that decision on the coach.  If the guy is medically cleared, the coach is there to make a football decision.  McDaniel shouldn't be making medical decisions on the field during games.

The NFL has to have an independent medical staff that overrides everything else.  ...not even one guy -- a medical team at each game where any one of them can hold out a player.  It's like the doctor in Star Trek -- it's the only person who can override the captain.

I may be in the minority, but I think we (or the NFL Doctors) screwed up in the Buffalo game and Tua was clearly concussed from the moment he had Bambi legs like a punch drunk boxer. If they determined he was impaired back then, he would have not been starting for the Bengals game.

At that stage someone from the medical field has to come in, be it the club doctor or an independent league doctor to say you're off for the next 30 minutes and you will be evaluated if its safe for you to come back on. Something seriously broke down back then - it was put under the microscope, and for a good reason.

Yes these guys are being paid serious $$$ to play with pain, but do you really want to see someone permanently brain damaged or die for your entertainment?

Lets not forget they put a "non medical spotter" in the stands the next game the dolphins played and they called down that Teddy Bridgewater was concussed and looked shaky on the first play of the game when he clearly wasn't hit anywhere near his head and wasn't shaky at all. It's all optics and politics and the A stands for asshole.

He raises a valid point.  Tua was clearly not himself after the hit.   Had he not used the word concussion, then this thread would not exist. 


Stronger protocols can be real simple.   If a player sustains a shot to the head and the trainers have to come out and assist him in getting off the field, then he's done for the remainder of the game, whether the doctors determine if he's concussed or not.   No exceptions.

That was a knee jerk reaction to what happened with Tua the two weeks before... lets not forget that.

If the medics actually did their job back then, none of that would have happened.

Don't you think this almost assures that you don't go help guys off the field unless they're like....knocked out???

Not necessarily.   A guy can take a shot to the head and end up crawling around and have trouble getting up.  Or the guy can get up and be real wobbly.   If that lasts for more than a few seconds, that's the cue for the trainers to come out.   

If the medical staff and the player himself says he is OK to play, then he should play. I have serious doubts about whether Tua had a concussion after Dirty Ass Milano hit him in the Buffalo game. I have had back problems for over a decade and can tell you for a fact that in certain situations you legs will give out or your knees will buckle. Also, getting up from the prone position will sometimes cause orthostatic hypotension (low blood pressure). That dizzy feeling you get when you stand up too fast from bending down. It can absolutely cause you to pass out or nearly pass out. It's easy to criticize decisions when you have the luxury of slow motion video of something that happened almost a year ago.

I don't want to see anyone get hurt, but with the amount of money these people make, if they want to play and are capable of playing. Make them sign ironclad waivers where they acknowledge that they themselves are responsible for their own decisions and resulting health issues down the road. And then let them play. As far as I'm concerned, it's no different from a grown adult choosing to drink, smoke, do drugs, sky dive, or bungee jump. Choices in life have consequences down the road

I've lost all respect for Stephen A Smith. He used to be a decent commentator, but he's decided that it's more important to him to get hits and now he's doing his shock jockey stuff. Talk about not believing what comes out someones mouth? Stephen A is example #1.

Having said that, I think Tua himself is to blame here, not McDaniel. Tua knows whether or not he was concussed. He lied. He absolutely did. He told them it was his back when it wasn't. Plain and simple. It's clear looking at the replays of it. Now did Tua have good reason to lie? Yes he did. He wants to keep playing. I get that. I can respect that out of Tua too, but he HAS to be smarter than that. You CAN'T let your ego get in the way. If he tells the doctors he was woozy there, he's not coming back in, end of story, but that's not what happened. This is another sign of Tua's immaturity. I get it, he's a young guy and full of piss and thinks nothing can hurt him. Well he's wrong. This is a big boy's game. And that doesn't mean you start acting like a tough guy, that means when you get hurt, you tell them you are hurt and you accept the fact that you're going to miss some time, for your own good. That's what being a big boy means. Is that unrealistic? I don't think so. In fact I think Tua owes that to his teammates. He's not doing any good out there playing with a concussion. I know a lot of you probably won't agree with me and that's fine. I just think this is what you do when you are the QB of a team. Team first. And if that means coming out of a game when you don't want to you do because it's the right thing to do, not because you want to.

I think that's a bit naive.  If going to check on a player means he has to leave for the rest of the game, trainers are only going to check on a player as an absolute last resort, which is a net negative.

Agree completely, all he wants is attention.

I'm not a medical expert but I'm going to assume that the concussion protocol evaluation is more extensive than asking the player "do you have a concussion?"

This is the biggest rub I have with the whole thing. My best friend's father had CTE and never played football. Larry Csonka used his head as a battering ram and is kicking it pretty well at 76. Mentally he is really good. The point being not everyone in football gets it and others who haven't played get it. Even if football increases the chances they are choosing to play. Boxers get concussions at a much higher rate and no one seems to care as they shouldn't. Around 1/2 of people who ride motorcycles do so without helmets. Hell, some people even refuse to ride a motorcycle as we all choose our own risk levels. 

Of for sure it is, but if the player is telling you that it's his back and that he wasn't woozy and you look into his eyes and he doesn't give you a blank stare, what are you going to do? You going to have the balls to say, nope he needs to come out. Yeah, I know that's your job, but how can you be certain? And yes you should fail on the side of caution, but there's more to it than that. It was the Bills. Big game. Tua saying he's fine. He's saying the right things. He doesn't look wrong. Hell he didn't even play that badly but in retrospect, we all know what happened. Yeah, it shouldn't have happened, but you can see how it did.