The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

Okay - I'm going to play the part of Billy Bean.  Former Cy Young winner, and 28 year old left handed pitcher, Barry Zito can be yours. 

For the right price.

Want him?  Make me a deal and sell me on it.

I'll give you a bag of Fritos that fell off the back of Crass's truck and an issue of Sports Illustrated from 1997.





I don't mean to be sarcastic - what do I have to work with here?

Hmmmm, i can't see anybody putting a deal together right now that will yank him away from Oak-town. I would assume any deal would include a slugger as well as that teams top minor league prospect. Any teams interested are probably reluctant and want to see which Zito shows up this year and then next season they can offer him a contract as a free agent.

Ok, i offer Jason Giambi and Phillip Hughes for Zito.

I don't have any interest in Giambi, I'm set at DH and first base.  Plus I can't take his salary.  Remember - this is Oakland.  I am interested in Hughes. 

Counter offer for Yankees:  Hughes and Robinson Cano.  Oakland will sign Zito to a 3 year deal prior to if Cano is involved prior to shipping him to you.

I just received two offers, one from Texas.  Clock is ticking.

Man, i was just about to propose this. Cano & Hughes. Interesting. 3 year deal is just right. I'll take that.

Oh no, i am having second thoughts..... ??? My heads gonna explode.

We have Cano and Hughes on the table - you're getting a guy that has a Cy Young under his belt, a lefty, and just turned 28.  Lefties come into their own as they get older.

So - what is your concern?

I guess i am going to pull the trigger on this one. If it were up to me i'd personally want to see what he looks like this season. He hasn't exactly been mr. consistency since that cy young.

Exactly my point on the thread - do you give up your future for a promising lefty that generally starts and ends each season in a rough fashion?

Now what do you do at second base?

Go with Cairo and cross my fingers...

bring back soriano!

Yankees get a potential ace that is inconsistent - yet always an innings eater.  Left handed pitchers might as well be made of gold.

A's get a young stud infielder that should have been rookie of the year and a fireball RHP prospect that throws in the mid 90's on every pitch and has a change up that dips to 81mph.

Now the question - if this trade went through - who got the better deal? 

His numbers against Boston and NY are embarrassing, his numbers have declined since his Cy Young year(when Pedro should've won it), and with mediocre guys liek AJ Burnett getting $11 Million, he will likely get $15 Million from some stupid team.

If I were Cashman I would give up Scott Proctor and Carl Pavano.

Remember - this is Oakland we're talking about.  They couldn't absorb Pavano's contract and wouldn't have interest in a journeyman like Proctor.

Zito's ERA has only been over 4.00 one time in his entire career - and keep in mind that he stays healthy.

I said those two as a way of showing how little I would want Zito. Pavano will probably sucks if he stays healthy, which is already out the window a she starts the year on the DL.

Proctor has talent but has never applied it, he too is useless.

Last 2 year's ERA's for Zito were 4.48 and 3.86. By now means bad, but not justifiable of a monster contract which is what he is looking for. Or even for a bunch of high grade prospects which is what Beane is looking for in a trade. Not to mention that his W/L the last 3 years has been 39-36.

His stats against perennial contenders like Boston and NY are horrible at best. Only a contender would trade fot Zito during the year, so how much value does he have if he can't perform well against the top teams? And Tampa Bay, which makes no sense, but whatever.

As a Yankee fan if he were put on waivers I would like to have him, but when you are looking to Carl Pavano or Aaron Small to play big roles oin winning, that isn't saying much.

That's why I started this thread - curious what people think of Zito's worth...

I am fairly certain Zito will be traded right after the All-Star break instead of days before the deadline. In that case, he will fetch 2 TOP prospects and maybe another decent one. Or, the prospects and the team will have to take on Loiaza because there is no way he succeeds in Oakland this year.

On the open FA market, I would imagine 5 years/$65 Million to a team like the Mets or Tigers. Boston won't go high for him because of their rookies coming up and Yankees have sworn off that shit for the moment.

This only happens if Barry has a winning record and an ERA in the low 3's for 2006.

I would offer Chacon, Mieng-Wang and a player to be named later (probably one of my top AA prospects).   

I can only assume you are a Red Sox fan.

Nope, I'm a Yankees fan.  They need to bolster their starting pitching.  I'm offering two part-time starters/long relievers and a prospect for Zito.  I didn't look at Chacon or Mieng-Wang's contracts though.  Maybe Maine can tell me if Oakland can handle them. 

Yes - both have contracts that Oakland could take.  Although they probably would flip Chacon to someone for a utility infielder rather than keeping him.

OK, like I said above..... I'm in need of some quality starting pitching.  I'm offering two capable spot starters/long-relievers and a prospect for Zito.  You will be able to save money on payroll by pulling the trigger on this deal.  Mieng-Wang looks like he could develop into a solid #2 or #3 starter later on down the road.  Do we have a deal?

Maine insert - I clicked on Tommy's post by accident - nothing has been changed by me in his response.

I have to admit,I really don't know much about Barry Zito...Just what I've picked up here and there....

If Oakland could take the contract of Greg Maddux (9 mil),and maybe a prospect a I'd do it...

If they couldn't take Greg's contract,I'd offer Jerome Williams (330,000)

I'm not a Maddux fan,if they don't give him the 2-4 inches off the plate,he gets knocked around too much...

Jerome Williams ,just hasn't impressed me all that much....

Well, Chacon did better than Zito last year. Chacon was even better than Zito on the road in the NL. Pitching at Coors Field is hazarddous to your career. So right off the bat I wouldn't make this deal.

Wang has injury problems which are a great concern, but he has fantastic stuff. Everything hit off of him is so weak because of his late movement. If he stays healthy I think this year he will be better too.

We don't have many top prospects, just some guys we feel can plug holes. Beane wouldn't settle for anything less than Duncan or Hughes. Hell, he wanted Wang, Cano and Duncan for Mark Kotsay  :o

Besides, Zito's ERA against Boston is like 7.00, so you don't want to mortgage your future for guys who can't beat your biggest rival.

Tommy - I don't think that we do.  I would still like to work something out with Hughes.  And don't listen to Edge, New York plays Boston 19 times in 2006.  Last time I checked - you have 162 games to play the entire season. 

Bottom line with Zito - he's 28.  Career 3.50 ERA.  Career 86 wins and 53 losses.  Averages 220 innings pitched EVERY YEAR.  Extremely durable.  Knocks on 190 K's each year.

Remember - right now he's a rent-a-player in his final year.  For the right deal with do a sign and trade and he's yours for three seasons.

Don't forget that Zito is your typical Oakland hippie. Going to corporate NY may not pan out so well. That, and 19 times a year can turn into 26 if both teams do well.

He would be more attractive if we traded for him and signed him long term, but I would rather wait until free agency hits and he is available.

P.S. He also has an excellent postseason history in his defense.

Personally I subscribe to Edge's worry about Zito's performance against Boston; which is why I wouldn't want him in Boston.  I'm not as worried about how he would perform in Boston or NY; while he is a big fish in a small pond he isn't exactly Jeff Weaver.  His talent certainly surpasses that.

Zito sparkles well in the playoffs - unless, of course, he's playing NYY or BOS.  A little more of a concern to play devil's advocate here - lefties generally ruin Boston's day.  Ted Lilly, Eric Milton, David Wells are a couple examples of lefties that Boston can't hit.  Why the success against Zito - who has better overall stuff than those three I just outlined?  Odd, indeed.

I know exactly why Zito fails against Boston and NY: his fastball. He has a HORRIBLE fastball. HORRIBLE. Not so much in velocity, but it has no movement.

When Jeter went through his 0-32 slide a few years back, he broke out of it with a HR against Zito on a fastball. The rest of the game NY hammered Zito on his fastball and only his fastball. His curve is still insane, but power hitters which is what Boston and NY have can turn on almost any fastball in a second. That's why he struggles against us.

FTR, I would give Zito the big contract over Hudson and Mulder. I have no idea what happened to Hudson last year. You would figure being coached by Mazzone, the weaker hitting league and the friendliest pitcher's division in baseball would make him a Cy Young lock. He had a good year, but not for $11 Million.

Don't dismiss changing leagues - Hudson was in the AL for a LONG TIME before the switch to the NL.  I think he struggled because he didn't know the hitters as well, look for a nice bounce back this year.

Good point on the fastball - but is it really that bad?  Texas has great power and he shuts them down pretty well.

If you just saw his fastball you would think it's average. When you see him throw his curve and then his fastball, it really magnifies how below average it is. The fact that he has carved out a very succesful career so far is a testament to how good his other stuff is.

OK, I could throw in Hughes as the player to be named later.  In return, I'd want a player to be named later from you, preferably a utility infielder or a solid backup catcher/firstbaseman. 

It's not like I haven't seen his fastball - I'm not agreeing with you that it's flat.  Again, he might get hit hard by the Sox and Yankees - but who doesn't?  They aren't the only power hitting teams in the AL.  Anyone that has a lifetime 3.50 ERA must have something more effective than a curve ball.  I know this from personal experience.