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Author Topic: Packers re-sign TE Finley  (Read 4422 times)
MikeO
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« Reply #15 on: February 26, 2012, 01:17:54 am »

What is foolish beyond belief is someone with a one track mind. Yes, Green Bay has a history of this. You stated the same example twice. Lets go back to 2009. Matt Cassel was up against Rex Grossman, J.P. Losman, Byron Leftwich, & Kyle Boler. None of them are named  Peyton Manning. Matt Stafford was the number one draft prospect. Number two was Mark Sanchez. Sanchez was not projected to go in the top 5. Which means, there would be other options this year without having to make that trade. If I were going to make a trade, it would be for the number two pick this year. Outside of Cassel in 2009, there was no option if you wanted a quarterback. This year there are options. That's why it would be a foolish trade.

This is where you are totally lost on this issue. Why is it foolish if a team WANTS Flynn and thinks he is best option for them to give up a pick to secure him and remove all risk of losing him?  This ain't fantasy football son, this is the real friggin thing. This ain't playing a video game with your buddy in your parents basement or having a couple beers using a cheet sheet and a No. 2 pencil. If you as a GM or a franchise all together and feel Flynn is the best fit for your team, you don't risk that. Especially if you are a bad team without a viable QB on the roster. Which is why a team like Cleveland or Seattle or Miami might part with a 2nd or 3rd round pick to secure him.

It doesn't matter who else is in the draft or who else is a free agent. If a team WANTS Flynn they will be willing to do what it takes to get him, remove all risk. A team like Seattle for example in a garbage division is a QB away from going to the playoffs and contending for the division, they don't want some rookie QB and growing pains of having to deal with that. They are in win-now mode. Why risk losing him? Over what a 2nd or 3rd round pick? That's f'n foolish!

All these so called "options" you speak of. Let's be real...1) Luck isn't an option for any team NOT named Indy.  2) Manning who the hell knows with his injury. 3) Tannehill has only 20 games as a QB in his life and is a total project 2-3 years away from being ready. Who are all of these options?

Once again, give up a 2nd or 3rd round pick for Flynn. Or give up 3 first round picks or 2 first round picks and a 2nd rounder (or in that ballpark) for RGIII. What is more realistic for a team, obviously the Flynn deal.

Let say you are Miami. And under one scenario Luck goes to Indy. Manning retires. RGIII goes to Cleveland after they trade up. You want to get in a bidding war with Seattle and Washington over Flynn? Or give up a 3rd round pick or a 2nd round pick and just land him and remove all risk? That's a foolish trade? HA! Yeah right!
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el diablo
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« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2012, 07:46:53 am »

It always comes down to options. The deadline for franchising Flynn is March 5. While Peyton's current roster bonus date is March 8. The draft is in late April. As of right now, Green Bay would be the team with the risk. You have said numerous times that Green Bay would franchise Flynn only if a deal was in place. Problem is no one has to agree to such a deal. Leaving Green Bay to hold the bag. Regardless of whether or not Flynn is franchised or becomes a free agent, a bidding war will ensue.
Simply giving up a 2nd or 3rd round pick won't work this time around. Not with Cleveland holding two 1st rd picks & a 2nd rd pick higher than Miami. Miami might be able to sweeten the pot by offering Cam Wake (considering he's cheap & GB needs the help). Great, Miami signs a QB, but just made the defense worse with less opportunity to fill that gap. If you're sold on Flynn, fine. My point being, if you're going to have to make trade you might as well try to trade for the no. 2 pick. I would definitely take RG III over Flynn.

It comes down to options. Peyton & the Colts could push back the roster signing bonus. There may not be a bidding war for either RG III or Flynn. Here's another twist. If Green Bay does use the franchise tag, they could be entitled to two 1st rd picks. They don't have to ask for that. Cleveland could fulfill that this year alone. Again, it doesn't matter if Flynn is franchised or not. It comes down to options.

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MikeO
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« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2012, 08:34:13 am »

It always comes down to options. The deadline for franchising Flynn is March 5. While Peyton's current roster bonus date is March 8. The draft is in late April. As of right now, Green Bay would be the team with the risk. You have said numerous times that Green Bay would franchise Flynn only if a deal was in place. Problem is no one has to agree to such a deal. Leaving Green Bay to hold the bag. Regardless of whether or not Flynn is franchised or becomes a free agent, a bidding war will ensue.
Simply giving up a 2nd or 3rd round pick won't work this time around. Not with Cleveland holding two 1st rd picks & a 2nd rd pick higher than Miami. Miami might be able to sweeten the pot by offering Cam Wake (considering he's cheap & GB needs the help). Great, Miami signs a QB, but just made the defense worse with less opportunity to fill that gap. If you're sold on Flynn, fine. My point being, if you're going to have to make trade you might as well try to trade for the no. 2 pick. I would definitely take RG III over Flynn.

It comes down to options. Peyton & the Colts could push back the roster signing bonus. There may not be a bidding war for either RG III or Flynn. Here's another twist. If Green Bay does use the franchise tag, they could be entitled to two 1st rd picks. They don't have to ask for that. Cleveland could fulfill that this year alone. Again, it doesn't matter if Flynn is franchised or not. It comes down to options.



You are treating this like a Fantasy Football draft. If we don't get person A we will just take person B and its all good. Like I said, this is the real thing. And if a team WANTS Flynn, they won't risk losing him. This isn't the 4th round pick in your fantasy draft at the local pub, this is the real thing. If a team works out a trade agreement with GB in prior to March 5th that they will trade a 2nd rounder for Flynn if GB tags Flynn....they aren't going to go back on their word!! These are billion dollar companies making a high level business deal. This isn't your drunk next door neighbor acting like a fool in a fantasy league. This is real life. You are presenting a fantasy land world scenario that makes no sense.

No team HAS to agree to a deal, but a team might WANT to!! To ensure they get the QB they WANT to build around. Why is that notion so hard to grasp? No team is giving up 2 first round picks for him either, I don't know how a team would be forced to do that or how GB is entitled to it? Once again, they aren't going to Franchise him hoping a team gives up two first rounders, they know that is impossible and won't happen. GB isn't stupid!

And if you think Miami will trade Cam Wake.....you really lost on the Dolphins and their offseason plans and what they will "consider" doing. I mean outer space lost.
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el diablo
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« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2012, 09:40:23 am »

I'll start by saying that I was mistaken by the Cleveland scenario. If Cleveland were to make an offer for a franchised Flynn, Green Bay would get Cleveland's 1st rd picks for 2012 & 2013. If GB chose not match the offer.
Now, if Cleveland were to go into a trade scenario with GB, that would be different. However they do hold better draft leverage than Miami does. At the same time, GB would not be restricted to just looking at draft picks for a trade for a franchised Flynn. This is why the Wake possibility makes sense fir them. Not so much for Miami. But Miami has trade personnel that Cleveland does not have. This is what creates a bidding war. Regardless of whether Flynn is franchised or not. The fact that a team might "really" want him only drives up Green Bay's side of the equation.
Its still a matter of options. Its just a question of what side has the most amount of leverage. The free agent route favors Washington because of Dan Snyder. The tag route favors Cleveland because of their draft position & Mike Holmgren. Miami has better offensive weapons with a coach Flynn is familiar with. Seattle is in a bad division with the potential of getting better weapons. It still comes down to options. Period.

BTW, it is fantasy football. The only difference is that the owners have to pay for their mistakes.
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Spider-Dan
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Bay Area Niner-Hater


« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2012, 10:20:34 am »

What is foolish beyond belief is someone with a one track mind. Yes, Green Bay has a history of this. You stated the same example twice. Lets go back to 2009. Matt Cassel was up against Rex Grossman, J.P. Losman, Byron Leftwich, & Kyle Boler. None of them are named  Peyton Manning.
CLE, JAX, KC, and SEA have no chance at getting Manning, no matter how much they are willing to spend.  Therefore, if one of those teams are interested in a QB upgrade (and they don't want to take the chance that they will lose out on Flynn), trading GB a 2nd is a plausible option for them.
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masterfins
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« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2012, 01:05:59 pm »

What the heck does all this talk of Flynn and the franchise tag have to do with The Pack re-signing Finley??  Holy hijacks Batman!
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MikeO
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Posts: 13582


« Reply #21 on: February 26, 2012, 01:09:06 pm »

What the heck does all this talk of Flynn and the franchise tag have to do with The Pack re-signing Finley??  Holy hijacks Batman!

Because the story is that GB signed Finley so early and so fast so they could use the franchise tag on Flynn. They couldn't tag both and they want to "possibly" tag Flynn if they can work out a deal with someone by March 5th.

Because if they couldn't work out a deal with Finley they were going to tag Finley. Now obviously they dont have too. It all ties together.
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MikeO
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Posts: 13582


« Reply #22 on: February 26, 2012, 05:33:01 pm »

NFL Network reporting GB won't tag Flynn and might use the tag on Wells because they obviously can't afford to lose Wells and they know Flynn is gone either way.

So take that report for what its worth
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