ANNE RICE

[BoSoxGrl]

Jesus ruins another perfectly good thread.

[CF DolFan]

wow, i can see this conversation going the following way:

person 1 - You're wrong
person 2 - no you're wrong
person 1 - no you're wrong
person 2 - no you're wrong
person 1 - no you're wrong

and what does that lead to?

not one person can claim they "Know" what's right and what's wrong .. if you think you do .. you're delusional. there's a reason it's called "Faith" .. because you have to believe it .. you don't "know" it .. if you knew it for a fact .. it wouldn't be faith .. it would be truth.


ps - for the record .. bigfoot is real dammit !

I'm not sure as to what point you, Dave, or your fiance are trying to make.

I wasn't arguing right or wrong. In fact, I purposely did not try to prove anything.  I was voicing a point of view so that St. Louis could understand why some people were against it.  Believe what you will  because it has no effect on me.  I just think it's sad.

I have to wonder why you guys aren't this dickish in person?   Is it because I bench 450 lbs or just the fact that you have no testicles aside from hiding behind a pc?   I am a Christian but I am not dead. Don't treat me disrepectly and not expect a reaction.

[Fau Teixeira]

I can't speak to Dave's points. It's not like we sit around coming up with talking points about topics of discussion.

My only point is that belief is in fact just that, and that each person has their own set. I think it's perfectly ok to have differences in beliefs. I'm not too thrilled about seeing things that people enjoy being called satanic .. but that's ok i guess. It just seems pretty negative.

And the reason i'm not "dickish in person" as you put it, is because:
a - i'm a generally nice guy and i've never had a harsh feeling towards you
b - i don't feel the attempt to proselytize in person.

I'll tell you one other thing, the hypocrisy of structured belief (not just christianity) is what bugs me. And is a MAJOR factor as to why i don't follow western religion.

Just for discussion's sake, what does the amount of lbs you bench have to do with anything, isn't it a major tenet of your religion that when you are struck to turn the other cheek ? Or that you should love even those that are your enemies. By that reasoning, whether you're physically imposing holds no bearing on whether i disagree with you or not.

The problem i have with strict adherence to the bible and that i can't reconcile is that it is ambiguous and contradictory. People have used the bible (and other dogmas) to justify anything they want. From slavery, to genocide, to just plain being mean to the grieving families of dead soldiers.

[BoSoxGrl]

And to add to Fau's point (my name is Kate BTW...not "Your Fiance") I have no problem with your set of beliefs, knock yourself out.  I just think it's very hypocritical that you are getting bent that my ideas are different and offensive then yours and I am sure that you never stopped to consider that throwing Jesus or Christianity into every argument may in fact, be offensive to myself and others.

It sucks that i come on here to hear interesting discussion and it turns into a Holy war.   If I wanted to be preached to, I would go to church.

[Dave Gray]

I think it's nuts for adults to believe that they have to warn their children of the dangers of magic.

If that makes me ripe for an ass-whippin' from someone stronger than me, so be it.

[SportsChick]

Jesus ruins another perfectly good thread.

QFT

[Buddhagirl]

I find it hilarious that Christians feel the need to warn their children of "magic", but have no problems LYING to them about a fat guy that magically enters the house to hand out gifts. Furthermore, his deer fly. Using what? Magic.

The entire thing is absurd.

How do christians explain life and the earth's creation? Magic. Except that they've changed it over to "God". He said let there be light, and there was.  Sounds like magic to me.

Geesh. Now I need a drink.

[bsfins]

Excuse me for the rant,and I know part f this should be in the other religion thread,but I think it all applies here...Please no one take this as a personal attack...(I'm just a dumb redneck)

I'm torn on I understand how CF is trying to raise his family,and respect his wishes to raise his children on his beliefs of the bible...And the way today's society is....

I'm not trying,to attack you CF...I want to ask, I know you have daughters, most little girls like to fantasize about growing up to be little princesses,and like to play fairy princess.What about the tooth fairy? What about the wizard of oz? Rudolph the red nose reindeer? Finding Nemo? I mean they know reindeer,Fish can't talk....How do you handle those type of things?

I was raised by a strict catholic,went to a catholic school for a few years..Where we prayed to St. Anthony when we lost something...My mom would tell me to pray to St. Peter,or St. Christopher....for different things..
So my world is totally different, when it comes to thoughts of magic,and such....

Nobody knows this but I am actually an ordained Christian minister

I'm sorry to say this doesn't hold alot of weight...I had a friend who was an minister,that was recognizable by the state,"The loyal order of Metallica wearing T-shirts"

Also Right now we have 4 clients, that are Ordained Ministers,all in jail ranging from Embezzlement,to rape charges....

This should have been in the other religious thread....But I'm gonna say it anyways....

I don't think being an atheist makes you a bad person,and being a Christian makes you a good person....Each case has to be weighed by their own merits,It's one thing to say you believe this and you're against that...It's another to actually live it..

[CF DolFan]

Just for discussion's sake, what does the amount of lbs you bench have to do with anything, isn't it a major tenet of your religion that when you are struck to turn the other cheek ? Or that you should love even those that are your enemies. By that reasoning, whether you're physically imposing holds no bearing on whether i disagree with you or not.

Trust me Fau ... if that is all that I did wrong I would be in great shape. I'm far from being Jesus.  I don't think my anger was intentended for you as much as you were the one I actually quoted.  Please accept my apology.

I think it's nuts for adults to believe that they have to warn their children of the dangers of magic.

OK I can understand that. I can't say I don't half agree with you but I do see both sides as my viewpoint lies somewhere in the middle.  10 years ago I might have laughed too. I certainly have picked on Bible thumpers in my day. I was frustrated by the mocking of me. Nothing more. It has nothing to do with your beliefs. The comments of "Kate" mean little to nothing to me as I have never met her... and don't really care to. I'm sure the feeling is mutual.  The mocking from people I have met and hung out with does not sit well with me.  At the very least, I expect a certain amount of respect as I'm sure I have proved not to be a fuitcake.  Somehow I don't think pissing in my face would have happpend had it not been behind a computer screen. You did it and then a few others piled on.  I didn't appreciate that as it was very disrepectful.

QFT

These are stupid comments meant to do nothing but flame.

I find it hilarious that Christians feel the need to warn their children of "magic", but have no problems LYING to them about a fat guy that magically enters the house to hand out gifts. Furthermore, his deer fly. Using what? Magic.

The entire thing is absurd.

How do christians explain life and the earth's creation? Magic. Except that they've changed it over to "God". He said let there be light, and there was.  Sounds like magic to me.

Geesh. Now I need a drink.

Wrong again. 
The same Christians who do not watch Harry Potter or things of that nature do NOT teach Santa Claus for that very reason.  I know many, many, Christians who do not use Santa Claus in celebration of Christmas.

[Dave Gray]

It's not a matter of respect.

When people make claims about completely mythical concepts, like witches and magic, I'm to going to attack them with the same scrutiny I would someone who made claims about Bigfoot or Astrology.

It's all hocus-pocus bullshit, disrespect or not.


As far as this "to your face" vs "behind a computer screen" thing, what can I say.  More than 99% or our conversation has come through computers, as I've only met you a handful of times, all around Dolphins games.  Magic just never came up.  It's not like I go through life, discussing religion, magic, and bigfoot with everyone I come across.  Surely you can understand that.

That's not to say that I don't ever discuss these things in public.  I do.  We're not cavemen, where I have to worry about getting beaten down for telling someone when they've got a screw loose.  Plus, I know my limits.  I don't seek out this kind of stuff.

But, be real, CF -- your beliefs are out there.  Be prepared to be scrutinized, not just by me, but by the world around you.  There's nothing disrespectful about that.

[CF DolFan]

Excuse me for the rant,and I know part f this should be in the other religion thread,but I think it all applies here...Please no one take this as a personal attack...(I'm just a dumb redneck)

I'm torn on I understand how CF is trying to raise his family,and respect his wishes to raise his children on his beliefs of the bible...And the way today's society is....

I'm not trying,to attack you CF...I want to ask, I know you have daughters, most little girls like to fantasize about growing up to be little princesses,and like to play fairy princess.What about the tooth fairy? What about the wizard of oz? Rudolph the red nose reindeer? Finding Nemo? I mean they know reindeer,Fish can't talk....How do you handle those type of things?

I was raised by a strict catholic,went to a catholic school for a few years..Where we prayed to St. Anthony when we lost something...My mom would tell me to pray to St. Peter,or St. Christopher....for different things..
So my world is totally different, when it comes to thoughts of magic,and such....

We celebrated with Santa Claus, the tooth fairy and even go out for Halloween. I really hated for my kids to lose that fantasy world so we participated.  I have no problem with make-believe but at the same time I do my best to help them see things from God's perspective ... age appropriate. Playing Cinderella and the bad witch is OK but following Sylvia Browne or when Grandma wants you to keep these crystals because her spirit guide told her it was for good luck I will stand firm.  Yes ... grandma has a spirit guide. 

It's my job to help my kids have a relationship with Jesus and not just learn the dos and don'ts. If this is accomplished and they will see the world's standards for what it is, and then everything else will be fine.  The laws of the bible have never saved one person but has chased many, many, people from the church. I am careful not to be legalistic but I'm sure I make misstakes.

There are many things in this world that people put priorities or worth on that I hope to show them is meaningless and in many cicumstances, dangerous.  Having an imagination is not one of them.

[Dave Gray]

Crystals and sprit guides = bullshit.

Sylvia Brown = fraud, preying on the weak and should be in jail.

[CF DolFan]

Crystals and sprit guides = bullshit.

Sylvia Brown = fraud, preying on the weak and should be in jail.

An awful lot of people follow her, John Edwards and Oprah.

[bsfins]

thank you for answering that....I live in an area,that belives alot of the same things you do...

My own personal beliefs,fall more in line of Daves' views...So I don't mean to be disrespectful at all...

To bring this back on topic in away...
To me this is alot like removing great literature from libraries,and in schools...It should not be banned,removed...for good parents,it should be a teaching tool...

[Dave Gray]

An awful lot of people follow her, John Edwards and Oprah.

John Edwards is just as bad.  I hate those people.  It's one thing if you're nuts and you actually think you're a psychic, but I think that both Edwards and Brown are giving cold-readings, manipulating people, knowing full-well that they're scam artists.

Oprah, I don't take issue with, as much.  She endorses some true dipshits on occasion, but I think that she's just getting duped herself.  I don't think she has ill-intentions.