Another government Stimulas package

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Where do you get the ACORN stat?

It was made up.  As are many of the false claims about the stimulus package. 

[Spider-Dan]

  This is stimulus?

$25 million for new ATV trails;
$400 million for the National Endowment for the Arts;
$400 million for global warming research;
$335 million for the Centers for Disease Control to combat sexually-transmitted diseases
$650 million coupons to subsidize TV viewers for digital television conversion.

And all of these items combined comprise less than 0.3 percent (that is, one-third of one percent) of the stimulus.  What a great example!

$275 billion in tax relief offered in the stimulus package focuses more on lower-income families.

So the middle American is basically left out?

If I say that when buying a car, I "focused more" on fuel economy than passenger capacity, do you take that to mean that I can't carry any passengers at all?

Why are groups like ACORN eligible for 4.2 Billion?

Because their area of involvement is relevant to people that are having homes foreclosed?

Why is Amtrak getting 300 million?

Because one of Obama's major campaign platforms was more energy independence, and expanded public transportation is a big part of that?

When is the last time Amtrak turned a profit?

Why is this even relevant?

[Dphins4me]

There is a widely believed theory that any extra money going to the wealthy is going to end up being put into savings. Lower income people are actually going to need to spend the money so that is going to help the economy. Imagine that, a stimulus package actually created to stimulate the economy. What a weird idea.

So now Middle Americans are wealthy?  Don't think so, they are the ones losing their jobs.

Where do you get the ACORN stat?

I just point out.  I posted Groups like ACORN.

House Republican Leader John Boehner issued a statement over the weekend noting that the stimulus bill wending its way through Congress provides $4.19 billion for "neighborhood stabilization activities."

He said the money was previously limited to state and local governments, but that Democrats now want part of it to be available to non-profit entities. That means groups like ACORN would be eligible for a portion of the funds

Amtrak is basically run by the DOT. Should the postal service not receive government money?

  Good God.  Not from a stimulus plan.

[Dphins4me]

It was made up.  As are many of the false claims about the stimulus package. 

Do some dang research & get your head out of Obama's arse. There are no false claims about the package.

This is not anti-Obama, but Anti Gov behavior.

 America cannot continue to spend money it does not have. We do not have this money.  Spending is what put us in the position we are in & we are not going to spend ourselves out it. The reason we bought Fannie & Freddie's bad debt is because China wouldn't buy anymore mortgage-backed securities.

 The only true stimulus needed is big cut in spending & tax relief on money being earned.  Yes, its slower, but solid.  There is no magic wand here.

[Phishfan]

Once you lose your job you technically are No Income so let's split hairs.

[Dphins4me]

And all of these items combined comprise less than 0.3 percent (that is, one-third of one percent) of the stimulus.  What a great example!

  Those were just a few examples.  Besides, its still wasteful spending of money we do not have. 

If I say that when buying a car, I "focused more" on fuel economy than passenger capacity, do you take that to mean that I can't carry any passengers at all?

I guess Forrest's mother was correct.

Because their area of involvement is relevant to people that are having homes foreclosed?

  Among other things.

Because one of Obama's major campaign platforms was more energy independence, and expanded public transportation is a big part of that?

  Money well spent then. 

Why is this even relevant?

  I guess when you do not have to be concerned with turning a profit, then the fact its lost money for decades is irrelevant.

[Dphins4me]

Once you lose your job you technically are No Income so let's split hairs.

  Unless you go out & find another job.

[Spider-Dan]

America cannot continue to spend money it does not have. We do not have this money.  Spending is what put us in the position we are in & we are not going to spend ourselves out it.

There is a difference between tax-and-spend and borrow-and-spend.  If you are willing to increase tax revenue, then spending can be accounted for.

The only true stimulus needed is big cut in spending & tax relief on money being earned.  Yes, its slower, but solid.  There is no magic wand here.

Um, we have already tried giving tax cuts to the obscenely wealthy and the whole trickle-down Reaganomics junk.  It failed.

If we, as a nation, really wanted to stay the course of tax cuts for the wealthy and more deregulation, the GOP would still be in power.  They are not.

[Dphins4me]

There is a difference between tax-and-spend and borrow-and-spend.  If you are willing to increase tax revenue, then spending can be accounted for.

Spending before having the money in any way is still borrowing.  Where it comes from after the fact does not change the fact you are still borrowing the cash from someone.

Um, we have already tried giving tax cuts to the obscenely wealthy and the whole trickle-down Reaganomics junk.  It failed.

If we, as a nation, really wanted to stay the course of tax cuts for the wealthy and more deregulation, the GOP would still be in power.  They are not.

  Who said anything about tax cuts for just the wealthy? You put 25% more dollars into working citizens pockets each month, then they are more likely to spend it on goods & services. Which gets the economy rolling.  Not building new ATV trails, which if anyone truly believes its actually going to ATV trails then you are ignorant..

Why is it when people say tax cut you go to wealthy?   Why is it when someone critizes something Gov now, its circle the wagons around Obama?   

My views here has nothing to do with Obama, but Gov in itself.  Obama is simply the head now, but the body/thinking remains the same. 

You people need to get off this Dem/Rep thing & get on with what is going on in Gov.

[Phishfan]

  Unless you go out & find another job.

I tell you what. Just for giggles why don't you quit your job tomorrow and then come back and let us know how that job search is going. We just had a job fair in Orlando. Over 6000 people showed up for less than 400 job openings.

[Dphins4me]

I tell you what. Just for giggles why don't you quit your job tomorrow and then come back and let us know how that job search is going. We just had a job fair in Orlando. Over 6000 people showed up for less than 400 job openings.

     If you think this stimulus plan is going to put people back to work anytime soon, then do a little research & stop with the little soundbites that do nothing but try to take the topic off on a tangent. 

The package has very little to do with stimulating the economy. 

[Spider-Dan]

Spending before having the money in any way is still borrowing.  Where it comes from after the fact does not change the fact you are still borrowing the cash from someone.

I guess you could consider taxes "borrowing," but "borrowing" implies that you intend to repay it.

  Who said anything about tax cuts for just the wealthy? You put 25% more dollars into working citizens pockets each month, then they are more likely to spend it on goods & services. Which gets the economy rolling.

Doesn't this stimulus plan have a $275B tax relief plan in it?

Not building new ATV trails, which if anyone truly believes its actually going to ATV trails then you are ignorant..

And again, said ATV trails comprise comprise 0.003% (that's three-thousandths of ONE PERCENT) of the package.

When the opponents spend such a large amount of time heavily criticizing less than one percent of the bill, it kind of makes you wonder why they are avoiding the rest of the bill.

Why is it when people say tax cut you go to wealthy?   Why is it when someone critizes something Gov now, its circle the wagons around Obama?

Huh?  I'm arguing against the supply-sider libertarian mentality... the one that proposes that we cut taxes to those that are the most well-off in order to benefit everyone else.  This argument predates Obama by many decades.

[Spider-Dan]

     If you think this stimulus plan is going to put people back to work anytime soon, then do a little research & stop with the little soundbites that do nothing but try to take the topic off on a tangent. 

The package has very little to do with stimulating the economy.

...except for the part about 64% of the $816B making its way into the economy in the first 19 months.

[MaineDolFan]

Not building new ATV trails, which if anyone truly believes its actually going to ATV trails then you are ignorant..

Color me ignorant.  

This isn't a "save the world, tidy up the woods" portion of this package.  Believe it or not, ATV trails generate economy for states.  Hard to grasp, I know - seems the easy thing to do is dismiss this as a "throw away" portion of the package and laugh at it versus actually looking at something in a subjective way.

This is from a New York Times article from a few years ago:

Indeed, the snowmobile infrastructure that has been developed in recent years accounts for much of the success, said Stephen Reiling, a University of Maine economist (and sometime snowmobiler) who is the principal author of the report. Snowmobile clubs and volunteers have built and maintained an elaborate 12,000-mile interstate trail system stretching into Canada and New Hampshire. In this area, the clubs, Chambers of Commerce and town officials cooperate to buy the grooming machines -- municipalities get lower interest rates on loans and are exempt from sales taxes -- and they are eventually repaid by state grants coming from snowmobile registration fees and a tiny share of gasoline taxes.

There is even a state snowmobile czar, Scott Ramsey of the Bureau of Parks and Lands, who last year took care of about 200 miles of state trails and distributed $902,000 in grants to towns and $344,000 to clubs to maintain club trails. Part of the $20 snowmobile registration fee goes to the Fish and Wildlife Service, whose game wardens are the state's most powerful police agency. The wardens set up roadblocks along the trails to nab drunken snowmobilers.

Northern Maine - used as one example of one little state - pulls in 300 million dollars to Maine's economy in the SNOWMOBILE SEASON ALONE.  Do you think people randomly go out and cut their own trails?  That isn't how it works.

Those same trails are used in spring / summer and fall as well - which generates money and jobs.  People flock to northern Maine.  This means the mom and pop stores have customers, the state needs game wardens, people are buying the sleds in the first place, people need places to sleep...

So let's put a little thought into this ATV trail thing that you are laughing so hard it first.  You want to talk objectively-do it.  

[Buddhagirl]

Color me ignorant.  

This isn't a "save the world, tidy up the woods" portion of this package.  Believe it or not, ATV trails generate economy for states.  Hard to grasp, I know - seems the easy thing to do is dismiss this as a "throw away" portion of the package and laugh at it versus actually looking at something in a subjective way.

This is from a New York Times article from a few years ago:

Indeed, the snowmobile infrastructure that has been developed in recent years accounts for much of the success, said Stephen Reiling, a University of Maine economist (and sometime snowmobiler) who is the principal author of the report. Snowmobile clubs and volunteers have built and maintained an elaborate 12,000-mile interstate trail system stretching into Canada and New Hampshire. In this area, the clubs, Chambers of Commerce and town officials cooperate to buy the grooming machines -- municipalities get lower interest rates on loans and are exempt from sales taxes -- and they are eventually repaid by state grants coming from snowmobile registration fees and a tiny share of gasoline taxes.

There is even a state snowmobile czar, Scott Ramsey of the Bureau of Parks and Lands, who last year took care of about 200 miles of state trails and distributed $902,000 in grants to towns and $344,000 to clubs to maintain club trails. Part of the $20 snowmobile registration fee goes to the Fish and Wildlife Service, whose game wardens are the state's most powerful police agency. The wardens set up roadblocks along the trails to nab drunken snowmobilers.

Northern Maine - used as one example of one little state - pulls in 300 million dollars to Maine's economy in the SNOWMOBILE SEASON ALONE.  Do you think people randomly go out and cut their own trails?  That isn't how it works.

Those same trails are used in spring / summer and fall as well - which generates money and jobs.  People flock to northern Maine.  This means the mom and pop stores have customers, the state needs game wardens, people are buying the sleds in the first place, people need places to sleep...

So let's put a little thought into this ATV trail thing that you are laughing so hard it first.  You want to talk objectively-do it.  

I was wondering if this was like the Rails to Trails thing. When you search those, some of them are snowmobile trails.