If you don't like Tim Tebow as a person....who is the ideal sports role model?

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82533f7d/article/tebows-day-not-ruined-by-highprofile-loss-to-patriots?module=HP11_cp

Not a question about his on-field play, but his off-field.

I hear people complaining about his praying too much or including god into too much and I have to wonder, if you think Tim Tebow is a bad sports role model, who is your ideal sports role model?

Lets see?  Is it Micheal Vick?  Tiger Woods? Plaxico Burres?  A. Cromartie?  PacMan Jones? 

Instead of spending the insane amount of money that NFL teams pay sports stars on hookers and drugs, he uses it to help sick children.  Instead of getting drunk after the game he inspires people with terminal illnesses. 

I don't share Tim's religious views, but if every kid in peewee football considered Tim his role model and wanted to model his life after Tim's (as opposed to the rest of the NFL players) I would say that would be wonderful. 

So who is your ideal sports hero?

[Spider-Dan]

Let me throw this name out there:  Kurt Warner.

See, while both of them are card-carrying members of Team Jesus, Warner didn't have an army of fans demanding that his coach allow him to play, and he never had anyone trying to excuse his subpar play by referencing his team's record.  He earned his way on to an NFL team, he played flawlessly when he got his shot, and when he was cast to the curb with STL and NYG, he did it all over again at ARI.

That's what I call a sports role model.

[Cathal]

I've got no problem with Tebow off the field. I would hope everyone would look up to be like him regardless of your religious convictions.

[fyo]

Warner also didn't incessantly bring Jesus into every single conversation. You like Jesus, we get it.

On the other hand, Warner's wife... Well, I'm not sure which wah that counts.

[EKnight]

Three points for consideration:
1. Tebow has NO control over the media, his fans, or what other people "want." It's a strawman argument. You can't hold what other people do or say against Tebow. His army of fans, any excuses made, etc. are not him, and are immaterial to HIS actual character.
2. I must have missed an entire realm of the NFL season, because I actually don't see Tebow talking religion as much as some people make it out to be. He thanks God when he wins; thousands of other athletes do the same thing. I get the impression that he does talk religion more than the average athlete, yes, but I also get the impression that the media and the anti-Tebow camp blow that out of proportion and make it more of a story than it is. EVERY press conference or interview with the guy has at least one religion-based question. What's he going to do- be a jerk like many other athletes often are, and ignore the question? I'm not saying I'm spot on with this, just that it's something I've seen, and no one else seems to consider. Go back and read some of his post-game press conferences. He thanks God to open, then doesn't mention him again, or may make mention once, as in "I thanked God when Barber ran out of bounds." EVERY other comment he makes is about his team; accolades for his teammates; belief in his coaches. Don't believe me- read for yourself. These are his answers to every question asked of him after the Chicago game:
"I don't think we necessarily get focused on the stats or what's happened in the past. Obviously, that can be frustrating. We had opportunities early and we didn't take advantage of them, so that kind of put us in a position where we were behind, which was disappointing.

"But guys kept encouraging one another, defense kept encouraging offense; the offense encouraging special teams. Just try to keep believing until the very end. It wasn't looking very good, but guys kept, shoot, encouraging me, at all times, believing in me, and we kept believing, and I think that's special when you have a team that believes and a team that's going to continually fight for 60 minutes, even though it's not looking good and even though it might be frustrating.

"We might have had opportunities and missed them, but we kept fighting and kept going, and the defense played phenomenal and came up with a bunch of huge stops, and we were finally able to get a drive there and score — a bunch of guys stepped up on that drive; the offensive line protected great, and D.T. stepped up on that drive; and Jeremiah and Lance and Deck, and a bunch of guys really stepped up, and we were able to get the ball back and find a way to go down there and.

"Shoot, it's kind of like a blur, I don't even remember everything that happened — but you can't say enough about Prater and how clutch he is and how much he means to our team. He's a great guy and a great person and a great player, and I'm proud that he's on our team."

Tim, was there a wrinkle that the Bears gave you that you had a little trouble figuring out?

"No sir, not really. I just think that we had some opportunities. You've got to give them credit, they are a very good defense. They came up with a bunch of big plays. Those two guys in the middle are pretty good. Brian Urlacher​ and Lance Briggs​ are pretty good, and it's fun to get to go against them.

They are known for, at least Urlacher, likes to chat with the quarterback. Did you have any conversations?

"Shoot, the only thing we talked about, pretty much, was he likes going to Florida to fish, and he came to one of our practices when I was in college at the University of Florida, and he was great. And Lance Briggs, what a player he is. They've got a lot of players. That interception Charles Tillman​ had was a great play. Bad decision on my part, which I can't have, and I've got to improve, but that was a great play."

Does it surprise, even you, so many things have to take place, just in this game, nevermind all the other things that happen. Marion Barber running out of bounds after the two minute warning?

"I might have thanked the Lord when he did that. I said, 'Oh, the Lord has something to do with it now.'

"He obviously, probably shouldn't do that, and that kept us in it. I mean, we probably would have had 10 seconds if he stayed in-bounds, but, it was just special.

"If you believe, unbelievable things can sometimes be possible. I think that's pretty special that we have a team that constantly believes and believes in each other."

Saying that, was there ever one time in the fourth quarter where you thought you were going to lose the football game?

"At certain times in the game where I was very frustrated and disappointed. Obviously, I thought we had opportunities — we had opportunities for the lead — so it was disappointing we were down 10-0. But great things are only possible if you're under very tough circumstances. That was a great comeback for this team, and it was led by our defense and coaches and a team that constantly believes."

Last week you laughed at me when I said you guys thrive in these situations. You clearly played better again today when it was the toughest situation to be in.

"I think my teammates make me look a lot better than I am. They really stepped up and came up with some huge plays, and I'm so proud of them. And the way D.T. stepped up on that last drive. You know, just good for him. I'm very proud of those guys.

"I think that is a character quality of a good team. When it is clutch and you need competitive greatness, you have to step up and you have to make those plays. If you're able to do it when it really matters, usually you can find a way. We've just got to get better at doing it for four quarters."

On the touchdown drive, you threw a pass earlier in the drive to Thomas and got blind-sided after you threw the ball. It was the second completion of the drive. You seemed to be a little woozy afterward when you got up. I was just wondering if…

"I'm feeling pretty good now. I necessarily don't remember that play well, it was kind of a blur. We had a lot of plays there on the last few drives. They had some good pressures and a good front, they got in there a few times and made some good plays. You got to give them credit there. Those are some really good players. Ryan Clady​ did a great job with Julius Peppers​ but he's a great player and he'll come up with some big plays too.

Were you frustrated by some of the dropped passes?

"I've just got to do a better job and just improve with accuracy and put it on my receivers more. They come up with a bunch of big plays, so I was just proud of their effort."

Regarding Tebow Time, do you think the clock needs to be readjusted a little bit? When you look at it, each game keeps coming down to the end and when you look at the first 3 ½ quarters statistically it's not pretty. How do you get this so you can do this a little earlier?

"I don't think it's 'Tebow Time'; I just think it's 'Bronco Time,' and the team steps up as a team. We play for one another and continue to trust one another, and I think that makes all the difference in the world."

Until everything went right, what was the most frustrating part today of everything going wrong?

"Just that we had opportunities, and we were able to move the ball and do some things, and it would be frustrating the way it got stopped or — one time it was, like a third-and-four, and I stepped up in the pocket and kind of made Urlacher miss, and then he got my foot, and I was a half-yard short of the first down. We get that first down, who knows what happens after that because we're already at midfield.

"When we got into the red zone, we had a few plays that they kind of snuffed out and did a good job on defense. Disappointed we didn't score there. And we also have a good drive going early, and I throw the pick to Tillman, and it was just frustrating because I felt like there were opportunities — even though a very good defense, and they made their plays — I felt like there were opportunities for us to get a lead in that game. It's disappointing that we didn't."

What did you tell Damarius Thomas after that last pass that went through his hands?

"I just said, 'Don't worry about it.' I actually told him — I was wrong — but I told him he was going to score the game-winning touchdown. He scored the one (touchdown) to get us within three, and then he came up with a bunch of huge plays to help us win it. He didn't technically score the game-winning touchdown, but I'll still give him the credit."

Why does it often take you so long to warm up? Fabulous again, not so fabulous…?

"I guess I just gotta get to the stadium and start practicing a little bit earlier. Just got to go back to the drawing board and find a way to get a little bit better in practice and try to improve and just try to get better as a quarterback and as a player and find a way to get this offense in the end zone early."

Does something come over you late? They talk about your eyes getting bigger? Does something come over you?

"I don't thinks so, Coach Meyer always preached at Florida, and Coach Fox always says it here. Coach Meyer always said 'competitive excellence.' When you're number is called; when it really matters, you're going to step up. And Coach Fox calls it 'competitive greatness.'

"It pretty much means the same thing: When you're number's called in the clutch time you better step up and make the play. I'm just proud that a lot of the guys on this team are like that, from our receivers to our offensive line to the defense to Prater to Britton . I'm just trying to improve every single day."

To Matt Willis — the guy is just clutch. Tell us a little about Matt Willis?

"I'm proud of Matt. He's definitely one of the more underrated guys, and he shouldn't be. He's a phenomenal receiver, and he's just so patient and so unselfish, and his approach and how plays — and he blocks so hard — and then when you need him in some clutch time he's going to step up and have huge catches. And you'll never hear from him. He'll never say, 'I was open' or 'Throw it to me,' but when you throw it to him he's going to step up and make the play, and I'm so proud and so happy he's on our team."

How would you describe just the last 6 to 8 weeks?

"It's definitely been somewhat of a whirlwind. been a lot of big games, and we've been fortunate to find a way to pull out most of them (7-1), and for us we've just got to take it one day at a time and figure out a way to improve; figure out a way to put the ball in the end zone earlier in games; and figure out a way to convert on third downs. I thought we did a little better job of that today, but a few other things would kind of stall us in drives. Sometimes you've got to give credit to the defense, but also I feel like we can just keep improving."

You're one game up in the AFC West, do you sense it's there for the taking?

"Well, like I said, it's one day at a time. That's something that's exciting and motivating, so it's not like we're not paying attention to that, it's just that we have to take it one day at a time, and we have to know what's on the line, and I think we have to up our game.

"Coach Fox talked about it: There's preseason; there's regular season; and then there's the playoff push before the playoffs, and we're in that playoff push. We have to find a way to get better and find a way to try and win some of these games."

How does the story end, Tim?

"That depends who's writing it.

"I think this has just been a great season, and I'm proud to be on a team with a bunch of guys who are high-character, coaches that are high-character, and however it ends I know I'm that I'm going to proud of all those guys and proud of the effort we put forth."

After the game, Brian Urlacher referred to you as a good running back. How do you take that comment?

"Coming from a really good player, that means a lot."


Where's the overwhelming talk of religion in that???

3. Warner- despite being a great role model and playing incredible, was FAR from flawless. The reason he was "cast to the curb" is because of his play. Bulger replaced him after he fumbled SIX TIMES in one game. I would think any QB would be replaced under those circumstances. That's not flawless. He also wasn't cut or "cast to the curb" by the Giants. He CHOSE to leave. He didn't resign because Eli was the future of that team, so he CHOSE to go to Arizona. He played his ass off there, and IMO should be in the HOF, but don't rewrite history and say he was "flawless," when he wasn't. Further, whether he was the greatest QB in the history of time or not, is immaterial to this thread. The original question, specifically, was "Not a question about his on-field play, but his off-field." Saying that Warner is somehow "better" than Tebow because of Tebow's fans calling for him to start, while Warner's didn't doesn't have anything to do with either of them specifically. It has to do with their fans. We already have a thread about that topic, do we not?

[Phishfan]

I don't like people digging around the sports world to find role models. Athletes and rock stars typically aren't role models. People need to teach their children the difference between what an entertainer and a role model is.

[masterfins]

EK thats just way too long of a post to read.  I think it's the media hype, more than it is Tebow.  Just thought of the movie North Dallas Forty when reading the OP talking about drugs and religion on football teams.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

I agree, Phishfan.....BUT the reality is kids do look up to sports and rock stars as role model. 

Okay, so both nominations for a better role model is a guy that is retired.  Almost 1700 active players in the NFL today.

  didn't have an army of fans demanding that his coach allow him to play

Spider -  I won't hold the actions of fans against a player. If he was a locker room problem demanding to play, I would hold that against him. Just like I wouldn't hold it against Matt Moore because Dolphin fans were calling for Henne to be benched. 

[Spider-Dan]

3. Warner- despite being a great role model and playing incredible, was FAR from flawless.

Warner earned his spot with his play, which (from 99-01) was as close to flawless as any 3-year stretch any QB has had in NFL history, I'd say.

The reason he was "cast to the curb" is because of his play. Bulger replaced him after he fumbled SIX TIMES in one game. I would think any QB would be replaced under those circumstances.

Are you honestly contending that an MVP QB will be released because of his play in one game?

How many times would Tom Brady have to fumble in order for NE to cut him?  6?  7?

He also wasn't cut or "cast to the curb" by the Giants. He CHOSE to leave. He didn't resign because Eli was the future of that team, so he CHOSE to go to Arizona.

False.  Warner signed a two-year deal with NYG in 2004 and was cut after one year, at which point he signed a 1-year, $4 million contract with ARI.

The original question, specifically, was "Not a question about his on-field play, but his off-field." Saying that Warner is somehow "better" than Tebow because of Tebow's fans calling for him to start, while Warner's didn't doesn't have anything to do with either of them specifically.

Warner worked his way up from the Arena League and earned his stripes, while still presenting the squeaky-clean image that Tebow does.  And that's my idea of a sports role model; someone that displays determination and hard work to achieve his accomplishments, instead of being handed opportunities as the "chosen one" because of non-football-related factors.

It almost seems like you're trying to argue that Warner is less of a model citizen than Tebow.  If so, I hope you have some evidence for this.

[Phishfan]

Can we not discuss his play in this thread? It was after all not supposed to be about play. We already have you arguing about this same thing in another thread Spider, can you just keep it there and stay on topic here?

[Phishfan]

I agree, Phishfan.....BUT the reality is kids do look up to sports and rock stars as role model. 

And quite possibly that is because parents are not sitting down and discussing having talent and being a role model do not necessarily equate.

[MaineDolFan]

Warner brought it up all the time.  The first thing out of his mouth, post game, every time, was to thank his personal Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

I guess memories are short around here.

Anyone ever watch a Nascar race?  These guys win and they rattle off "I'd like to thank.." and then go on a 3 minute shopping list of all their sponsors.  Somehow that doesn't bother people as much as the thanking Jesus stuff does.  I guess as long as you're thinking Home Depot, Dr. Pepper and Quickie Lube it's okay.

Personally, I tune it all out.  I don't care what any of these guys have to say.  I just want to watch them play.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Can we not discuss his play in this thread? It was after all not supposed to be about play. We already have you arguing about this same thing in another thread Spider, can you just keep it there and stay on topic here?

+1 That is why I started a different thread.  His skills as a football player have been discussed ad nasuem.  I don't get the hate against him as a person and his character.  As if most people in his profession are better role models.

And quite possibly that is because parents are not sitting down and discussing having talent and being a role model do not necessarily equate.

Umm... yeah, because a parent sitting down and telling their teenager not consider sports stars role models or heros will automaticly convince them to look elsewhere for their role models.  

[Phishfan]

I know it won't cure all ills and it isn't like one discussion would do it either. It is more complex than that and revolves more around how the kids are raised their entire lives. Parents don't sit down and have these types of discussions nearly enough. In fact many parents I know don;t even try to be role models themselves.

In combination and over a period of time it will help to create a mindset. That is more what I'm trying to say. Some will listen, some won't Some will understand, some won't. Kids can still admire their these athletes and entertainers talents. They can act like them on the playground or in front of a mirror. They need to understand that these talents don't make them role models though.

[EKnight]

Warner earned his spot with his play, which (from 99-01) was as close to flawless as any 3-year stretch any QB has had in NFL history, I'd say.
Are you honestly contending that an MVP QB will be released because of his play in one game?

How many times would Tom Brady have to fumble in order for NE to cut him?  6?  7?
False.  Warner signed a two-year deal with NYG in 2004 and was cut after one year, at which point he signed a 1-year, $4 million contract with ARI.
Warner worked his way up from the Arena League and earned his stripes, while still presenting the squeaky-clean image that Tebow does.  And that's my idea of a sports role model; someone that displays determination and hard work to achieve his accomplishments, instead of being handed opportunities as the "chosen one" because of non-football-related factors.

It almost seems like you're trying to argue that Warner is less of a model citizen than Tebow.  If so, I hope you have some evidence for this.

Not saying that AT ALL. Stop putting words in my mouth to fuel your argument. There's another thread about play. Put your weak argument there. This was about off the fireld stuff. Warner's play- which I ALREADY STATED should make him a HOF-er-- has nothing to do with this argument. And for the record, he fumbled six times, and gave way to a better QB at that time, which is why Bulger kept his spot. Why did you duck the only pertinant points I made to this thread? His fans have nothing to do with Tebow's own actions, and his press conference wasn't quite so much peppered with religion as you want it to be to make yourself seem correct. -EK