Jeff Ireland is laughing...

[badger6]

I don't agree that it's a "culture" thing. I believe it's a class thing. As in, lack thereof. Its too easy to turn culture into a stereotype. At the same time, T.O.  and Ocho may be "flashy", but they don't get in trouble with the law. Rex Ryan isn't black, yet no one lankest him as a "diva" coach. They definitely don't call him black. At worst, he's an individual. Yet, these receivers can't be seen in the same light. What Dez Bryant allegedly did, was wrong. Not every player arrested is a black receiver. Nor were they all black players. Its like using a Fox Newsism. "Not all black receivers are divas, but all divas are black receivers." That's a bullshit argument. Now if you'll excuse me, I have a discussion celebration to choreograph.

I will agree with you that it is a class thing also. But I would say that black culture plays into it just as much. I never said that all black and no whites are like that. Having said that though, I would venture to say that the majority of this behavior is from the black culture, you may be able to pick a white or Hispanic guy here or there, but no where near the percentage. The reason stereotypes exist is because there is an element of truth to them many times. Ask yourself this question. Do you see black people ACTING flashy, bragging, and running their mouths more than other ethnic groups ?

[el diablo]

I will agree with you that it is a class thing also. But I would say that black culture plays into it just as much. I never said that all black and no whites are like that. Having said that though, I would venture to say that the majority of this behavior is from the black culture, you may be able to pick a white or Hispanic guy here or there, but no where near the percentage. The reason stereotypes exist is because there is an element of truth to them many times. Ask yourself this question. Do you see black people ACTING flashy, bragging, and running their mouths more than other ethnic groups ?

I see your point. However, I would say that it depends on the environment. If I'm watching TV, then more blacks act like that. I lived in El Paso for 4 years. I would say more Hispanics acted like that then. My job now takes me across the midwest & southeast. And I would say more whites act like that. So again, it would depend on the environment.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Show me white players that run their mouth like T.O., Ocho Cinco, Bart Scott, Randy Moss, Joey Porter, Channing Crowder or any other of the countless black players.

I guess the formula turns in revese at the coaching level.  Show me a black coach with a worse foul mouth than Rex Ryan or a white coach that is a respectful as Tony Dungy. 

[badger6]

I guess the formula turns in revese at the coaching level.  Show me a black coach with a worse foul mouth than Rex Ryan or a white coach that is a respectful as Tony Dungy. 

Totally different scenario. Most coaches wouldn't make it doing and saying what Rex Ryan does. If Dungy or any multitude of black or white coaches had a mouth like Ryan they wouldn't wouldn't have made it in my opinion. Rex Ryan is overhyped and living off his prior family success. That's how he got where he is.

Show me white players that run their mouth like T.O., Ocho Cinco, Bart Scott, Randy Moss, Joey Porter, Channing Crowder or any other of the countless black players. Not saying that all black players are like that, nor am I saying that there are no white players that are like that. But the overwhelming majority of the loud, rude, flashy, bragging is from the black players.

Well I listed several just off the top of my head, but can't really think of any white players that do that. If you can please do. Jeremy Shocky has been mentioned a couple times. I can accept that, but I would say he is more opinionated as opposed to flashy and always bragging about himself like a high school drama queen diva. I may be wrong about him though as I haven't really kept up with him that much, but I do remember him being kind of obnoxious. As far as Welker goes, I disagree, getting into a fight or a scuffle is totally different than what I'm talking about.

Ask yourself this question. Do you see black people ACTING flashy, bragging, and running their mouths more than other ethnic groups ?

Well do you ?

[Phishfan]

Quoting yourself in a thread is about as "flashy" as speaking in third person. 

[badger6]

Quoting yourself in a thread is about as "flashy" as speaking in third person. 

Not really, but if you say so. Just repeating my questions. I have found through numerous threads here that people won't answer a simple question. Even though they disagree with you they won't answer and tippy toe around the subject. Blacks, whites, and all other ethnic groups have positives and negatives about them. Does that make it wrong to talk about ?

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Just repeating my questions. I have found through numerous threads here that people won't answer a simple question.

No point.  I answered your question with an counter example, proving your question flawed.  You dismissed.  Bottom line is nobody is going to convince to drop your racist prejudices. 

[badger6]

No point.  I answered your question with an counter example, proving your question flawed.  You dismissed.  Bottom line is nobody is going to convince to drop your racist prejudices. 

You answered my question with a counter example ? Flawed question ? The only flawed question is one that can't be understood or one that is ambiguous. My question was very straight forward with a simple yes or no answer, a third grader could understand it. BTW, You answer a question with an answer, not a counter example and only thing you proved is your flawed logic or your purposeful avoidance of the perfectly acceptable topic. A topic that was brought up by someone else who on the surface seems to agree with me. Who might I add is black. You gonna call him a prejudice racist too ?

I agree it's a culture thing... I myself have fallen into the show and flash during my lifetime.   It's kinda a old slave mentality thing.  It's a running joke amongst most of us (blacks) that ever since the slave owners separated house and field slaves... that we've never been the same!   In the black community it has gone on for decades that people use to being poor and not having anything tended to show off once they aquired things.   It was a way to show that they were different than others or favored!   Thus the saying that since master divided us we have never been able to unite!

You see it with some lighter skin blacks... they feel they are better because they're not black or as black!  Many blacks from other countries consider themselves better than American blacks!  I remember growing up how many Hatians and Jamacains refused to be classified as black because they felt it was a insult to lump them with American blacks who they looked down upon themselves!

Some people aren't adult enough to discuss adult things. These people would rather cry and whine like a little 12 year old school girl having her first period rather than acting like a man. Boo fucking hoo, go cry to momma.

Anyhow, I would like to thank Diehard_Dolfan and el diablo for having a somewhat civil discussion, even if we don't totally agree.
 /thread

[BigDaddyFin]

I don't get the Divia receiver sickness!

I hate to admit but, it only seems to afflict black receivers!    I can't ever remember any white receivers that were head cases! 

Probably because there aren't that many white wide recievers in the NFL. 

[Brian Fein]

Probably because there aren't that many white wide recievers in the NFL. 

bingo!

The population of wide receivers is predominantly black.  I couldn't find the demographics numbers.  If you put 50 black marbles and 5 white marble in a bag and randomly choose 6 of them, what are the odds that all 6 will be black?

[el diablo]

Anyhow, I would like to thank Diehard_Dolfan and el diablo for having a somewhat civil discussion, even if we don't totally agree.
 /thread

During this teachable moment, I would like to thank Badger for the acknowledgement. We may disagree, but at least I'm always open to a deeper understanding. As if it matters, I'm also black.

[el diablo]

bingo!

The population of wide receivers is predominantly black.  I couldn't find the demographics numbers.  If you put 50 black marbles and 5 white marble in a bag and randomly choose 6 of them, what are the odds that all 6 will be black?

Great point. I don't know the odds (probabilities are above my pay grade), but are we to assume that the other 39 black marbles are predisposed to become flashy? Couldn't we assume that the 6 flashy black marbles are just flashy individuals? Do we assume that the 5 white marbles are "immune" from becoming flashy? Or is it that if they become flashy they were influenced by the 6 black flashy ones? This is the problem with generalizations. A mere 13% of the black marbles somehow become the "normal" behavior trait for 100% of a population.

[Brian Fein]

no, assume all marbles have the same probability of being flashy.  the 6 you choose are the flashy ones.

I'm not following your numbers.

50 black marbles, 5 white ones.  55 total.  pick 6.  I'm guessing you have somewhere around 90% chance that all 6 flashy ones are black.

This builds on the assumption that all marbles have equal chance of being flashy and the result is still the same.

[suck for luck]

6 time marbles champ Marty King retires from the American Marbles Tour

I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the flashiness of their marbles, but by the content of their character.

[Spider-Dan]

If you have a bag of 55 marbles, 50 of which are black, the probability of removing 6 black marbles in a row (presuming you don't put them back in the bag as you remove them) is 54.81%.  (It's a ~90% chance to pull out 1 black marble, but the odds of pulling out 6 in a row is roughly 0.9 x 0.9 x 0.9 x 0.9 x 0.9 x 0.9, or ~50%.)

That being said, when you consider that it's really only the elite WRs that are going to be divas, and that the overwhelming majority (more than 90%) of elite WRs are black, and that one of the extremely rare elite white WRs ALSO got in trouble for being a diva, the analogy isn't quite accurate.