2013 Hall of Fame Ballot

[Dave Gray]

This whole debate is stupid.  Sportswriters are punishing players for ethics.  Put the best players in the hall of fame.  It's not the hall of integrity.  Just take out the integrity clause altogether and put in Rose, the Blacksox, and the rest of the roid-heads.

[bsfins]

^^ Actually, it's part of the Qualification to get in the Hall...
(there is the integrity Clause)

5. Voting: Voting shall be based upon the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship, character, and contributions to the team(s) on which the player played. <-Link to HOF website

[Landshark]

This whole debate is stupid.  Sportswriters are punishing players for ethics.  Put the best players in the hall of fame.  It's not the hall of integrity.  Just take out the integrity clause altogether and put in Rose, the Blacksox, and the rest of the roid-heads.

The question is, should the integrity clause apply to Pete Rose the player, when it was Pete Rose the manager who committed the acts that got him banned from baseball?

[EDGECRUSHER]

I don't think morality should apply, but that is different from taking steroids. To me, morality means was he a good citizen (Ty Cobb was not, despite large amounts of charitable work he did not want anyone to know about), any arrests or wife beatings (looking at you, Brett Myers).

Steroids flat out make you a better player that turns Scrubs into All-Stars (Melky Cabrera), All-Stars into MVPs (Giambi) and they make Hall of Famers into the Greatest of All-Time (Bonds and Clemens). So I do think that is worth debating and keeping guys out for. What I strongly disagree with is what they did to Piazza. They are just punishing him for playing in the same era as steroid users with absolutely no proof or reasonable doubt other than he was really good.

Also, whoever voted for Aaron Sele shouldn't be allowed to vote anymore.

[Pappy13]

I think that you have to suck it up and put guys like Bonds and Clemens in the hall.  Steroids were part of the game.  And especially in cases where these guys weren't specficially caught, you have to let them in.

Especially now that Lance Armstrong has made a mockery of the testing process. You can test negative all you want, I don't believe for a second that you AREN'T using PED's. As far as I'm concerned every last person in sports is finding a way to cheat. Why single out these guys?

[Fau Teixeira]

we should just not test for PED . .let everyone dope as much as they want .. then it'll be an even playing field

[Dave Gray]

I think that the MLB didn't do their job to test, they knew it was happening, and they let it happen when it was convenient for them (when they wanted rating for the epic homerun battle).  Now, they want to wag their finger.

And Lil B, I know that there is an integrity clause.  I'm saying that they should remove it.  It's also stupid because you have known scumbags that are in the hall.  Ty Cobb is a sonofabitch by all accounts and nobody is trying to kick him out.

[EDGECRUSHER]

One of the biggest problem is the MLBPA and how powerful they are. The easiest way to stop steroids is this "Those who fail a PED test will be suspended for one year and have their current contract voided at the team's discretion". Done, no more steroids.

Of course, the union would never allow that.

[Spider-Dan]

One of the biggest problem is the MLBPA and how powerful they are. The easiest way to stop steroids is this "Those who fail a PED test will be suspended for one year and have their current contract voided at the team's discretion". Done, no more steroids.

Of course, the union would never allow that.

They would be incredibly stupid to do so.

Do you not see the glaring conflict of interest in a team being allowed to instantly void the contract of a player who failed a test, when said team provides medical support to this player on a regular basis?

"LATE-BREAKING NEWS - CARL CRAWFORD HAS MYSTERIOUSLY TESTED POSITIVE FOR BANNED SUBSTANCES!   RED SOX BRASS UNFORTUNATELY FORCED TO TERMINATE HIS ALBATROSS CONTRACT!"

[EDGECRUSHER]

I wouldn't be worried about that too much, as I am sure if both parties ever agreed to this, there would be testing doctors on both sides.

They wouldn't agree with it because there is nothing to gain but everything to lose.

[bsfins]

I'd be stalking Alfonso Soriano,hoping to get that one chance to spike his drink with anything on the banned substance list... 

[Spider-Dan]

I wouldn't be worried about that too much, as I am sure if both parties ever agreed to this, there would be testing doctors on both sides.

What difference would that make?

Team trainer slips player banned substance.
Player fails both the team test and the union test.
Player proclaims his innocence; no one cares.
Player's contract is voided.

[EDGECRUSHER]

I was referring to chain of command and whether or not the samples would be mishandled or tainted or even switched after the fact. If this ever passed, which it will NEVER, I imagine a Union Doctor would always be present in the clubhouse, especially when injections or medicines or administered.

Unless you are Mike Trout and have a favorable contract, then you would not poison a great guy. A-Rod and Teixeira should watch out.

[Spider-Dan]

Unless you are Mike Trout and have a favorable contract, then you would not poison a great guy. A-Rod and Teixeira should watch out.

And that's why such a policy would never be implemented.  It's an obvious escape hatch.