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Poll
Question: Pick 4 for Mount Rushmore.
Nick Buoniconti   -2 (1.9%)
Mark Clayton   -2 (1.9%)
Larry Csonka   -22 (21.2%)
Bob Griese   -9 (8.7%)
Larry Little   -0 (0%)
Dan Marino   -26 (25%)
Don Shula   -26 (25%)
Dwight Stephenson   -1 (1%)
Jason Taylor   -12 (11.5%)
Zach Thomas   -2 (1.9%)
Paul Warfield   -0 (0%)
Richmond Webb   -0 (0%)
Other (detail in thread)   -2 (1.9%)
Total Voters: 23

Author Topic: Who would you put on the Dolphins' Mount Rushmore?  (Read 23438 times)
Dave Gray
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« Reply #60 on: July 17, 2013, 12:27:28 pm »
I think you can definitely make a case for Griese over Taylor.

Mt. Rushmore isn't just for the best players or even the best impact, but for the best legacy.  It's unclear at this point how JT will be judged by history.  Griese is very much still a part of this football community.  He does local broadcasts and is associated with the most prosperous time in the team's history.

Though I believe Taylor was a better player than Griese, he did leave and play elsewhere for a couple of years.  I do think that playing a final season here will help a lot and my position on him may soften, but for now, I don't put him up there.  Also, Taylor seems to be taking on a more national legacy than a local one.

If we're just going to talk about the best players, you'd be putting Paul Warfield up there in the 4 spot.
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Spider-Dan
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« Reply #61 on: July 17, 2013, 01:58:49 pm »
I don't think Warfield was as good at his position (relative to his peers) as Taylor was at his.
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Dave Gray
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« Reply #62 on: July 17, 2013, 03:09:54 pm »
I never saw him play, but I thought that Warfield was one of the best WRs ever -- like game-changingly good at the position, especially for the time.  Is that not the case?  I mean -- I have no idea, but that's what I've been led to believe.
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Phishfan
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« Reply #63 on: July 17, 2013, 03:13:52 pm »
^^^ His catch numbers are not very high but his yard per catch were impressive. According to Wikipedia he only had 29 catches during the 1973 season but 11 were for TDs. He only averaged 30 some catches per year over 13 season.
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« Reply #64 on: July 17, 2013, 03:45:14 pm »
That was a different NFL back then.  Teams would win with running and defense.  Super Bowl winning QB's would throw 8 balls for under 100 yards in the entire game.
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« Reply #65 on: July 17, 2013, 03:45:53 pm »
It's really hard to compare over generations.  30 catches is acceptable, but we're a pass heavy league now.  It used to be all running.  I have no idea how impressive 30 catches were in the 70s.
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« Reply #66 on: July 17, 2013, 05:01:36 pm »
Quote from: Dave Gray on July 17, 2013, 03:45:53 pm
It's really hard to compare over generations.  30 catches is acceptable, but we're a pass heavy league now.  It used to be all running.  I have no idea how impressive 30 catches were in the 70s.

Warfield's reception numbers were never impressive...catching a ton of passes wasn't really his game. Only twice in his career did he crack the top-10 in the league in receptions: In 1964, he finished 9th with 52 catches, and in 1968, he finished 6th with 50 catches. He did lead the NFL in receiving TDs two different seasons, and was pretty consistently among the league leaders in yards per reception. In the "Career Yards per Touch" category, which factors in rushing, receiving and return yards, he stands tied at #2 in NFL history at 19.5 yards per touch.  Paul Warfield = Big Plays


* stats from pro-football-reference.com
« Last Edit: July 17, 2013, 05:03:10 pm by Sunstroke » Logged
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« Reply #67 on: July 17, 2013, 06:42:29 pm »
If the Dolphins are lucky (extremely lucky), maybe Mike Wallace's career arc will resemble Warfield's.
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« Reply #68 on: July 17, 2013, 06:44:28 pm »

I hope Wallace catches more passes than Warfield did...
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« Reply #69 on: July 17, 2013, 11:32:41 pm »
Quote from: Dave Gray on July 17, 2013, 03:09:54 pm
I never saw him play, but I thought that Warfield was one of the best WRs ever -- like game-changingly good at the position
And you don't think Taylor was? Everytime he returned a turnover for a TD that was definitely a game-changing play. How many of those did he have in his career? There were other game changing plays as well, that's just off the top of my head. Some of you are seriously short changing JT and if it's not for him leaving and going to play for the Jets and skins, then I'm completely baffled by it.
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chunkyb
« Reply #70 on: July 18, 2013, 10:51:51 am »
Similarly to Zach, We all loved Zach Thomas, but does anyone really think he was one of the best MLB's of ALL TIME?

Considering the great linebackers in NFL history - Lawrence Taylor, Ray Lewis, Butkus, Mike Singletary, do you really think Zach Thomas belongs on the same list as these guys?  Sure he was a great DOLPHIN player and we all remember him fondly, but he's not one of the best of all time.
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« Reply #71 on: July 18, 2013, 11:34:51 am »
I think everyone in this thread realizes Zach actually is a long-shot to get into the HOF.  But Zach is not JT.
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« Reply #72 on: July 18, 2013, 02:46:30 pm »
^^ Right - so why is Zach's name on this list of nominees, and Jim Langer (a HOFer) is not?

My point the entire time is that we all show a bias (subconscious or otherwise) toward more recent players.
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« Reply #73 on: July 18, 2013, 03:27:41 pm »
Maybe I'm undervaluing Taylor, but no, I wouldn't consider him among the most elite DEs of all time.  Maybe I'm wrong...I'm no expert and I personally like Taylor and loved him as a player.  I'm just trying to be objective. 
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« Reply #74 on: July 18, 2013, 03:58:39 pm »
To be fair, he doesn't have to be an elite DE of all time.  He has to be an elite Dolphins' player.

To me, Larry Csonka isn't one of the best RB's of all time, but he absolutely belongs on this list due to his value to the franchise.

Jason Taylor is one of the best Dolphins' players of all time.
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