Parcells vs Ireland drama

[MikeO]

Bill Parcells at the Hall of Fame press conference today said he no longer speaks with Jeff Ireland.

That bromance is over!

[Landshark]

I have zero interest in anything Parcells has to say, as a result of what he did to the Dolphins.  Found this on the internet.  You can add a few other things such as signed Gibril Wilson and Ernest Wiliford and drafted Patrick Turner to this list. 

[MikeO]

He's the NFL's biggest a-hole. Great coach who peaked in 1990! Terrible front office person. Screwed over teams like Atlanta and Tampa multiple times by leading them on and agreeing to deals then backing out. Bailed on the Pats and Jets. And failed in Dallas and Miami.

If he had retired in 1990 after his 2nd Super Bowl and stayed away his legacy would be off the charts. He came back and showed the world that well, maybe Belichick was the brains of the operation!

I hope there is a short 20 minute rain shower tonight just when its his time to speak!

[Brian Fein]

Maybe the lack of talking to Parcells is a contributing factor to what I'd consider a drastic improvement by Jeff Ireland in the past 2 seasons.

[Spider-Dan]

He's the NFL's biggest a-hole. Great coach who peaked in 1990! Terrible front office person.

I'd say he did a pretty good job with NE and NYJ.  I believe he has (literally) the only non-tiebreaker AFCE division title in Jets history, and while he looks like a bum in NE compared to Belichick, he brought them to respectability.  Bledsoe over Mirer (i.e. Washington State over Notre Dame) was also a non-trivial pick, and Curtis Martin (who he convinced to come over from NE) is arguably the best Jet of all time.

[MikeO]

I'd say he did a pretty good job with NE and NYJ.  I believe he has (literally) the only non-tiebreaker AFCE title in Jets history.

NE, took them to a Super Bowl. Kudos to that but he did lose the big game.  In NY he did was take them to an AFC Championship game. Lots of coaches have made that game, and he lost in that game. Blew a halftime lead in fact. Hardly an accomplishment to heap praise on. As I said from 1990 on he was an average coach with a lot of baggage.  Made one Super Bowl (and lost)...made an AFC title game (and lost). Failed miserably in Dallas and Miami. There are lots of coaches who have resumes similar to that. Some successes and a lot of failures.

From the early 80's to 1990 he was great. No doubt, can't knock him for that. After he left the Giants...not so much. Very ordinary coach. Nothing special.

[Spider-Dan]

Good is relative.  What he did for NYJ would be considered pathetically unacceptable failure in PIT, GB, or even MIA.  But for the Jets, he's their best coach since the merger (unless you consider an AFCC loss as better than a division title).

Also: if Parcells retires permanently in 1990 then NE remains one of the worst franchises of all time.  Belichick doesn't get the NE job without Parcells, and Parcells acquired a lot of the pieces on NE's first SB winning team.

[MikeO]

Good is relative.  What he did for NYJ would be considered pathetically unacceptable failure in PIT, GB, or even MIA.  But for the Jets, he's their best coach since the merger (unless you consider an AFCC loss as better than a division title).

Also: if Parcells retires permanently in 1990 then NE remains one of the worst franchises of all time.  Belichick doesn't get the NE job without Parcells, and Parcells acquired a lot of the pieces on NE's first SB winning team.

uh, NE's first super bowl team was all Brady. That team was BAD until Brady took over. Those pieces other than Brady that Parcells brought in earlier weren't doing much. The 2000 Pats which were Parcells guys went 5-11 and were 0-2 in 2001 before Brady took over. Brady was the only difference in 2001 and he wasn't a Parcells guy. Parcells left that franchise a wreck. Well a 5-11 team in reality!

And you are so wrong about Belichick not getting the Pats job without Parcells. Belichick incase you forgot was hired by the Jets a job he got after Parcells quit. Kraft stole him away last minute from under the Jets nose.  Belichick was a hot assistant who had a rough end in Cleveland as the head coach because of the Modell moving the team fiasco. Belichick was getting another job with or without Parcells. And he got the Pats job with no help at all from Parcells.  If you had said the Jets job, you would have been correct. But the Pats job...nope! He got that on his own.

Parcells being the Jets best head coach since the merger isn't something that means a whole hell of a lot. In fact its a worthless piece of info. Not something that helps get you into the Hall of Fame. It says more about the Jets than it does him.

[Spider-Dan]

And you are so wrong about Belichick not getting the Pats job without Parcells. Belichick incase you forgot was hired by the Jets a job he got after Parcells quit.

Actually, Belichick followed Parcells to the Jets as his DC (after following Parcells to NE as his DC there), then was scheduled to inherit the Jets HC position.  Kraft, having established a relationship with Belichick in NE, was able to convince him to resign from the HC job he already had in the bag (with a better team) and come to NE.

If Parcells never goes to NE, there is no way in hell that Belichick leaves NYJ to go to NE.  It's absurd to claim otherwise.

[MikeO]

Actually, Belichick followed Parcells to the Jets as his DC (after following Parcells to NE as his DC there), then was scheduled to inherit the Jets HC position.  Kraft, having established a relationship with Belichick in NE, was able to convince him to resign from the HC job he already had in the bag (with a better team) and come to NE.

If Parcells never goes to NE, there is no way in hell that Belichick leaves NYJ to go to NE.  It's absurd to claim otherwise.

I know the history, I just explained it to ya a couple posts before. You want to give Parcells credit for the Pats rings which is foolish. That was ALL Brady and Belichick and Parcells had no hand in that at all.

And none of this has anything to do with Parcells being a Hall of Fame coach. If Parcells is in the Hall of Fame then Jimmy Johnson deserves to be in. He won the same amount of rings and built a mini-dynasty down in Dallas.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

I'd say he did a pretty good job with NE and NYJ.  I believe he has (literally) the only non-tiebreaker AFCE division title in Jets history, and while he looks like a bum in NE compared to Belichick, he brought them to respectability.  Bledsoe over Mirer (i.e. Washington State over Notre Dame) was also a non-trivial pick, and Curtis Martin (who he convinced to come over from NE) is arguably the best Jet of all time.

You look at Parcells record when he had an assistant coach named Bill Belichick and his record when he didn't.

With BB: All of his years with the Giants.  Two superbowl wins.  1 AFC Championship in NE.  Three winning seasons with the Jets.

W/o BB: 3 years in NE -  No playoffs, 2 losing seasons.  Dallas & Mia. 

[Landshark]

You look at Parcells record when he had an assistant coach named Bill Belichick and his record when he didn't.

With BB: All of his years with the Giants.  Two superbowl wins.  1 AFC Championship in NE.  Three winning seasons with the Jets.

W/o BB: 3 years in NE -  No playoffs, 2 losing seasons.  Dallas & Mia. 

He did have a winning record with the Pats in 1994.  Made the playoffs only to get knocked out in the first round by none other than Belicheat and the Cleveland Browns

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

If Parcells never goes to NE, there is no way in hell that Belichick leaves NYJ to go to NE.  It's absurd to claim otherwise.

If Parcells doesn't go to NE, big question what happens to BB.  He wasn't exactly highly sought after post being fired by the Browns.  Parcells offered his ex-DC the same job in NE, much the same way BB gave Josh McD his old job back after being fired as a HC.   

[Spider-Dan]

I know the history, I just explained it to ya a couple posts before. You want to give Parcells credit for the Pats rings which is foolish. That was ALL Brady and Belichick and Parcells had no hand in that at all.

So why are you giving Belichick credit?  I mean, he was the HC before Brady and went 6-11, then Brady stepped in and won titles.  The one year Brady goes down (leaving behind the highest scoring offense in the history of the league, mind you), Belichick lost the division to a team that finished 1-15 the year before.  By your logic, Belichick deserves no credit either.

I also find it quite interesting that you give Brady all the credit for holding a 500-point Rams team to 3 points for the first 3 quarters.

And none of this has anything to do with Parcells being a Hall of Fame coach. If Parcells is in the Hall of Fame then Jimmy Johnson deserves to be in.

Did Jimmy Johnson take over a 2-14 team and get them to the SB?
Did he then take a 1-15 team to the conference championship game, having more success with that team than any other coach in 20+ years?

It's like you look at each individual thing and then say "that's not enough" in a vacuum.  (And obviously, you're wrong, because he's in the HOF.)  It's the combination of all of them.

[MikeO]

So why are you giving Belichick credit? 

He drafted Brady. Debate over!