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Author Topic: Ryan Tannehill will be great...  (Read 7334 times)
CF DolFan
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« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2013, 11:03:53 am »

While not addressing the o-line constitutes way more than one move I don't see them firing him either. Unfortunately we will suffer another year or two of him.
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MikeO
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« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2013, 11:06:51 am »

Miami has a lot of money to spend and are way under the cap. Keep Pouncey and Martin. And he will just buy a couple o-linemen in free agency next year. Draft one early. And address it that way.

The only players we have to re-sign are Grimes and Soliai so we will have money to spend. I think Starks might be let go to use that money to bring in an o-linmen.
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Brian Fein
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« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2013, 11:25:20 am »

Unfortunately we will suffer another year or two of him.

This is the part I don't agree with. 

If you're looking for a GM that hits on 100% of his moves, then you'll always be disappointed.  All GM's miss here and there.  You want one that hits more than he misses, and I think Ireland has done that the past 2 years.  NOT trading for a guy is not as bad of a miss as trading for a guy that doesn't work out.
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MikeO
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« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2013, 05:17:16 pm »

This is the part I don't agree with. 

If you're looking for a GM that hits on 100% of his moves, then you'll always be disappointed.  All GM's miss here and there.  You want one that hits more than he misses, and I think Ireland has done that the past 2 years.  NOT trading for a guy is not as bad of a miss as trading for a guy that doesn't work out.

I agree. Look, no GM bats a thousand. As long as a GM hits on a QB (the most important position), and after that has more hits than misses everywhere else, that's all you can ask for really. Look, we should have traded for Brandon Albert at the draft, that was a mistake. BUT, I do agree that not trading for a guy is not as bad a miss as trading for a guy that doesn't work out or giving a FA a "bad contract." Good GM's and good franchises these days for the most part won't give out "bad contracts"...they would rather let a player walk and figure out how to fix a problem on the team without said player than give a guy a deal that ties their hands moving forward.  New England has let lots of so called "star players" walk, GB has, Pittsburgh has....they would rather lose a guy than give out a bad contract.  A bad contract is a death nail for a franchise long-term. For all the money Ireland/Miami spent this year, he gave out no bad/crazy deals and Miami still has $20+ mill in cap space for next year. He has this franchise set up nicely cap wise and really offensive line is the only glaring need. Sure a better player at this spot or that spot would be nice. But the o-line is the main thing left. Aside from Grimes and Soliai/Starks...the defense is young and locked up in long-term deal. That's good! On offense the WR's are locked up, the QB is locked up, Miller is locked up...aside from locking up Clay and getting a 2nd RB to compliment Miller (cause Thomas is done in Miami)....its really just the o-line that needs to be addressed and then you start plugging a spot here or a spot there. But Miami's "core" to build around is almost all in place.  And we have the cap space to do it!

Once Philbin came they finally did "rebuilding" the right way! No more crazy contracts that tie up the cap! They didn't overpay for Jared Cook. They didn't overpay for Long. They didn't give an old injury prone RB a long-term deal...they are rebuilding it the right way! yes those players MIGHT and probably ARE upgrades over the current guys on this team at thos positions, but that's not how you build a winner. It's about finding the right guy at the right price at the right age! They had the money to do ALL of those things I mentioned above, but they didn't. Cause you can't give out bad contracts! It will kill a franchise.

Like in 2011 when Miami started 0-7 and had NO cap space and was maxed out on the cap. How does that happen where you totally suck and have no cap space, who are you paying? You get that way when you give out bad contracts. Now Miami stands 3-2, is beating solid teams and hanging in there with the defending champs in Baltimore, and still has $20 mill in cap space. No bad contracts!
« Last Edit: October 08, 2013, 05:29:54 pm by MikeO » Logged
Diehard_Dolfan
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« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2013, 05:51:55 pm »

I agree. Look, no GM bats a thousand. As long as a GM hits on a QB (the most important position), and after that has more hits than misses everywhere else, that's all you can ask for really. Look, we should have traded for Brandon Albert at the draft, that was a mistake. BUT, I do agree that not trading for a guy is not as bad a miss as trading for a guy that doesn't work out or giving a FA a "bad contract." Good GM's and good franchises these days for the most part won't give out "bad contracts"...they would rather let a player walk and figure out how to fix a problem on the team without said player than give a guy a deal that ties their hands moving forward.  New England has let lots of so called "star players" walk, GB has, Pittsburgh has....they would rather lose a guy than give out a bad contract.  A bad contract is a death nail for a franchise long-term. For all the money Ireland/Miami spent this year, he gave out no bad/crazy deals and Miami still has $20+ mill in cap space for next year. He has this franchise set up nicely cap wise and really offensive line is the only glaring need. Sure a better player at this spot or that spot would be nice. But the o-line is the main thing left. Aside from Grimes and Soliai/Starks...the defense is young and locked up in long-term deal. That's good! On offense the WR's are locked up, the QB is locked up, Miller is locked up...aside from locking up Clay and getting a 2nd RB to compliment Miller (cause Thomas is done in Miami)....its really just the o-line that needs to be addressed and then you start plugging a spot here or a spot there. But Miami's "core" to build around is almost all in place.  And we have the cap space to do it!

Once Philbin came they finally did "rebuilding" the right way! No more crazy contracts that tie up the cap! They didn't overpay for Jared Cook. They didn't overpay for Long. They didn't give an old injury prone RB a long-term deal...they are rebuilding it the right way! yes those players MIGHT and probably ARE upgrades over the current guys on this team at thos positions, but that's not how you build a winner. It's about finding the right guy at the right price at the right age! They had the money to do ALL of those things I mentioned above, but they didn't. Cause you can't give out bad contracts! It will kill a franchise.

Like in 2011 when Miami started 0-7 and had NO cap space and was maxed out on the cap. How does that happen where you totally suck and have no cap space, who are you paying? You get that way when you give out bad contracts. Now Miami stands 3-2, is beating solid teams and hanging in there with the defending champs in Baltimore, and still has $20 mill in cap space. No bad contracts!

I agree with this... I just wish we would have taken TY Hilton!  The money we'd saved on Wallace equals more cap space and you still got a guy that can stretch the field for far less money and much younger!

I guess you can tell I really liked Hilton! lol
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Pappy13
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« Reply #20 on: October 08, 2013, 06:00:07 pm »

I'd personally like to see Tannehill avoid the rush by staying mobile.  He tends to sit in the pocket until the rush gets to him and then duck and protect the ball. 

Which is OK - we don't need him fumbling it away.

But, I've seen opportunities for him to step up or take a step to the side and have more time.  Or heaven forbid he should scramble for a few yards.  I am sick of seeing him curl up into the fetal position the moment a defender gets within 3 feet of him.
Escaping from pressure by scrambling is easier when there is only 1 person applying pressure. The problem is that if you watch the games pressure is coming from ALL directions. You CANNOT scramble out of such protection issues as moving in one direction simply puts you into the path of the next oncoming rusher. I've seen very few opportunities for Tannehill to escape pressure by scrambling, in fact when there is that opportunity, he usually does.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2013, 06:03:39 pm by Pappy13 » Logged

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MikeO
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« Reply #21 on: October 08, 2013, 11:52:26 pm »

Escaping from pressure by scrambling is easier when there is only 1 person applying pressure. The problem is that if you watch the games pressure is coming from ALL directions. You CANNOT scramble out of such protection issues as moving in one direction simply puts you into the path of the next oncoming rusher. I've seen very few opportunities for Tannehill to escape pressure by scrambling, in fact when there is that opportunity, he usually does.

Look this is all on the o-line this year. Can you point to a sack here or there where Tannehill should have gotten rid of it ...maybe. But the vast majority of these sacks are on the o-line/TE's not blocking anybody. We are already in the shotgun damn near every play aside from a rolling pocket every play (which limits the plays you can actually run) there isn't much you can do.

My idea is do what Indy did to us Week 2......go with a 6 man offensive line. Screw the fullback and add an o-linemen and play Clay at TE more.
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Brian Fein
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chunkyb
« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2013, 11:03:32 am »

^^ would be nice, but the problem is you pull Clay out of the pattern, if you leave a back in for max protect, then you only have 2 guys running routes and 8 guys trying to keep your QB upright.  Not sure how you can be successful that way...
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MikeO
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« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2013, 11:21:27 am »

^^ would be nice, but the problem is you pull Clay out of the pattern, if you leave a back in for max protect, then you only have 2 guys running routes and 8 guys trying to keep your QB upright.  Not sure how you can be successful that way...

gotta run the ball with success to open up play action. Not saying do it full time but throw it in as a wrinkle here and there
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MyGodWearsAHoodie
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« Reply #24 on: October 09, 2013, 11:38:36 am »

NOT trading for a guy is not as bad of a miss as trading for a guy that doesn't work out.

I agree with the rest of your argument, but not this part.  You need to be aggressive to win.  You shouldn't spend a ton of money or high picks on risky players, but to win you need to take risks particular ones with high upside, low downside. 

Look at the combo of these two trades by Belichick:  Randy Moss and Albert Haynesworth.  One was considered a brilliant trade, the other a bust.  But I am not disappointed with BB.  The only way to avoid busts like AH, is to shy away from trades like RM.  But if you think RM was worth a 4th and 5th pick, instead of just a 4th round pick, then in aggregate his trade approach is positive.   
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Diehard_Dolfan
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« Reply #25 on: October 11, 2013, 09:35:53 pm »

Tanny boy needs to trust that Wallace can go get it and let the deep ball go! If Wallace can't get there no one else is getting there for sure! Just knowing your willing to go deep gives the defense something to worry about.   That will loosen up the defense and give Clay and the wr's some working room.   

I also agree we need to throw more screens to Miller/Thigpen and let them get out in space...  If the line can't hold blocks then throwing screens will take pressure off them and slow down the blitz.  The Saints did it to us to negate our pass rush... we need to do it to others!
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EDGECRUSHER
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« Reply #26 on: October 13, 2013, 12:53:49 pm »

Trust in Wallace will come when he stops dropping passes like he is Ted Ginn.
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Diehard_Dolfan
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« Reply #27 on: October 13, 2013, 08:35:42 pm »

Trust has nothing to do with under throwing a receiver behind coverage!  Angry 
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shamphin
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« Reply #28 on: October 20, 2013, 04:49:05 pm »

Tannehill will not be great. Yeah his o-line needs work a lot of work but he takes too many sacks and loses the ball too much. He has no pocket presence at all none. He never sees the pocket breaking down not to hard to hit a statue. No matter how big your arm is its no good if you can't hit your target in the big moments. Stop making excuses for him the o-line is what it is deal with it. Tannehill wont lead this team to any kind of championship he's at best a good backup. I watched him in college and he was then and is now a turnover waiting to happen. Tannehill will not be great! Just sayin Cry
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CF DolFan
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« Reply #29 on: October 20, 2013, 04:52:35 pm »

I disagree. If he didn't stand in the pocket then we wouldn't have three wins. Give him time and then start criticizing him. As it is if he doesn't take one for the team he'd never get a significant throw off. 
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