Richie Suspended

[RhodeIslandPhinFan]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000276100/article/richie-incognito-suspended-by-miami-dolphins

[Spider-Dan]

Incognito was pretty much known as a scumbag when he was with the Rams.

So who is at fault for this debacle?

- Martin, for complaining?
- Incognito, for acting like the Richie Incognito known around the league?
- Philbin/Ireland, for doing nothing to fix this?

I say the latter.  For all the hoopla about "Philbin guys" and "Long/Bush/Dansby leadership team" and "Marshall didn't fit the culture," to allow this kind of problem to fester in the locker room while doing nothing shows utter incompetence.  And unlike 2-time champion Coughlin, this group has no excuse and cannot simply wave this away.

[Spider-Dan]

Interesting note from the thread announcing Incognito's original visit with the Dolphins:

If anyone can control this guy its Parcells. And even if we get a 15 yarder here or there, if he can get us some time to chuck a few 15 yarders as well I'm all for it. Holding penalties drive me Nuts. Knocking someone on their ass penalties is worth the price IMO for the dividends it pays off in attitude. can you imagine Ginn stepping out of bounds instead of taking a hit while this guy is around?

So basically, someone who will intimidate players on his own team.  Hmmm.

[el diablo]

Spider, I see where you're coming from. Personally I found the whole "Philbin Guy" thing to be a joke. Instead of using the "leadership council" to his advantage, he saw it as a threat to his authority. Unfortunately, we don't know if Martin had made his concerns known prior to his depature. We don't know if Philbin had an open door policy. I believe in a chain of command. And it doesn't look like they had one. Because if they did, it wouldn't have gotten to this point. Especially when they take this sort of stuff seriously. So seriously, that they ask the NFL to investigate an internal matter. Not Martin, the team. This situation has gotten beyond ridiculous.

[MikeO]

Thank god they took action. This story is so childish and stupid I am so sick of it. Martin is done in Miami. Richie is probably done, I would be shocked if we saw him play again this year and since its his final year of his contract he has played his last game for the Fins. Back to football.

[CF DolFan]

Do you honestly think this is about Incognito? Do you really think coaching has anything to do with it? Do you really think the NFL didn't know what goes is going on in these locker rooms? It is a part of the game. They may make him the scapegoat but knowing Incognito ... I don't see him going away quietly.

Every team does this and it isn't bullying. The freaking NFL is the fraternity of all fraternities. These guys do not have to play. It is a privilege and there is always someone waiting for your spot if you don't want it.

I'm cracking up with Joe Rose and his stories of hazing rookies and the most underlying factor is the more they complained the worse it got. This went on before Shula and will continue long after Wussygate. I've spoken to a someone who pretty much confirmed my feelings and that Martin will get his regardless of where he goes. This is so far from being just a Miami Dolphin problem.

[Landshark]

^^^^^^^^^^^^

Pulling pranks like dying rookies hair is one thing.  Using them as ATMs is another.   I can understand having one team dinner a year which is paid for by all the rookies.  But to constantly go on those outings and put it all on one rookie each time is messed up. 

[hordman]

Spider-Dan is right.  You got to blame the guys at the top of the food chain for this debacle.  Philbin saying " I can say without question that we emphasize a culture of team-first accountability and respect for one another. Any behavior that deviates from that is inconsistent from the values of our organization. That’s all I’ll say in regards to that."

He's full of shit.  He had an idea if this stuff was going on.

Also, from the story:
The Dolphins are expected to work with Nate Garner at left guard and Tyson Clabo at right tackle. Both players manned those positions against the Cincinnati Bengals after Martin went AWOL from the team prior to the game and Incognito suffered a stinger in his neck in the first half and was unable to return to the game.


How karma is that, that Igcognito suffered a stinger in the CIN game and was unable to play! LOL

[Dolphster]

^^^^^^^^^^^^

Pulling pranks like dying rookies hair is one thing.  Using them as ATMs is another.   I can understand having one team dinner a year which is paid for by all the rookies.  But to constantly go on those outings and put it all on one rookie each time is messed up. 

That's pretty much where I'm coming from too.  I'm fine with "hazing" for lack of a better term.  And I'm even fine with making the rookies pick up the tab for a night on the town.   But to use them as ATMs, as Landshark put it, is overkill.  Even though I was a (brief) career minor-leaguer, even in baseball we had a pecking order where newbies had to put up with a lot of grief as part of "paying their dues" and it actually goes a long way towards team unity and "family".  If you make it past your rookie year, you then get to do to the next group what was done to you.  Hell, we all look back and laugh about the times that we were "terrorized" as newbies by our teammates and now recall those times fondly.  But when you are making guys give up large percentages of their relatively meager rookie salaries to continually fund team parties, etc. then you are messing with a man's livelhihood and that is crossing the line.  Although like I said, making the Rooks pay for one dinner or night on the town for the veterans is fine. 

[CF DolFan]

Well hopefully we can have some IBM guys draw up the guidelines for the NFL so it can become more pussified than it is.

It's the freaking NFL where machismo is what drives each of these guys to pound each other in the sand. you can't force them to work within the same guidelines of librarians and want to be lawyers. 

[Jim Gray]

We don't know the full story yet, but based on some of what's leaking out to the media, this sounds like more than just some hazing.  If it turns out that what's being reported is true, then it's completely unacceptable and Incognito should never play another down for the Dolphins.  I don't say this lightly.  Incognito has been one of my favorite players and a bright spot for the team.  

If you have never been systematically bullied before, it's hard to imagine the fear involved.  I had a friend in High School who was bullied by 3 guys a year older than us.  They constantly picked at him making him miserable.  In the end, it was just too much for him and he hung himself in a walk in freezer with a garden hose while working at McDonalds.  It wasn't one big threat that pushed him over the edge.  It was the constant, unrelenting harassment.  

Just because Martin is a big guy, it doesn't mean that he can't be bullied.   Martin's reps told the Dolphins that Martin was afraid of Incognito.  That shouldn't happen with teammates playing on the same unit.

With all the bad things that have happened to the Dolphins, for me this is the worst.  We all ask how it is that highly ranked linemen come here and underachieve.  Maybe we have our answer.  Maybe this isn't really a team, just a collection of guys who don't feel the same connection with the guys they play with.  

[CF DolFan]

We don't know the full story yet, but based on some of what's leaking out to the media, this sounds like more than just some hazing.

It's being piece milled for sensationalism. For instance ... the $30,000 bill was split between many players. Other "rookies" and young players don't seem to have an issue.

“Everything tastes better when rookies pay for it,” veteran defensive end Jared Odrick wrote on Twitter over the weekend. “Yes, the bill would make you sick.”

Younger players were handed the tab for a $30,000 team dinner, according to a source. The rookie minimum salary this year is about $400,000.

Will Davis, a rookie cornerback, tweeted Sunday: “The bill was definitely split. . . . They would never put that on one man to pay for it all. Haha now that would be crazy . . .”

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/11/04/3729152/incognito-dolphins-push-back-against.html#storylink=cpy

[Jim Gray]

CF, some of what is being claimed may be bullshit, but let's assume the claims are true.  When does it cross the line from fraternal hazing to harassment?   I'm okay with rookies carrying pads, getting a bad haircut, getting a unflattering nickname and paying for a team dinner, but that's not what I'm hearing. 

Rookies required to pay for multiple veterans meals
Martin paying 15K for the linemen to go to Vegas (a trip he didn't make)
Messages and texts that Martin feels are threatening (racially charged)
Making fun of Martin's family

It's like the hazing didn't stop for Martin.  Maybe he's more sensitive than other players.  So what.  It doesn't make it okay.  Bullies do what they do because they are miserable with themselves and need to pump themselves up at someone else expense.  Once it starts, it doesn't stop.  I think in most cases they don't ever admit to themselves that what they do is harmful - "we are just having a laugh".  Some level of hazing builds a bond based on common experiences, but if you go to far you destroy that bond.

Initially, it looks like the Dolphins tried to downplay this and sweep it under the rug.  They need Incognito.  I have to believe that the action they took were in response to evidence of misconduct.  This is more than a story some of an overly sensitive lineman.   

[hordman]

Wow Jim, that's a sad sorry about your friend.  No one should have to put with stuff like that throughout their life, especially at a young age where sometimes people feel they have nowhere or no one to turn to.

Look, I get the rookie hazing, and pulling pranks to get one over on the guys, but when it's systematic hounding, bullying, whatever you call it and it affects one's life and how they function day to day.....fock that noise.

That's not friendship or teammate IMO, that's doing it for the sake that you can get away it and being a prick and no one has ever stood up to you and knocked your dick in the dirt.  Look, Richie's got a history, we know that or at least what was published in the media.  NFL players rank him near the top as a dirty player, he was in that bar fight (ummm, being peacemaker, sorry) during the summer.  He PRIDES himself on this, don't let him fool you.  He likes it.

Whatever, I'm over it.  Richie is gone and now we are out of a LT/RT in Martin.  So basically his actions have cost MIA two starting players on the OL.

Good job, good effort Richie.

[MikeO]

http://deadspin.com/is-richie-incognitos-dad-blasting-jonathan-martin-on-m-1457997230?utm_campaign=socialflow_deadspin_twitter&utm_source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

Richies dad is posting crap on message boards now....lol. This is a circus.  Richie's season is over. No coming back this year