Deflategate is back

[Baba Booey]

I wish I could find the true facts of the case somewhere.   

really you don't know the facts of this case yet after 18 months?

[masterfins]

Answer this question for me:

Is there a quarterback in the NFL, whom, if inserted into the New England lineup, would make the Patriots not favored against the Dolphins?  It does make the task much easier for them, though. 

Even with Jimmy G, the Dolphins still have to stop Gronk and that receiving corps. 

I think your a little high from your continual Patriot jock sniffing.  The NE receiving corps, with the exception of Gronkowski, is mediocre.  They would all be #3 receivers on any team without a HOF QB placing the ball in their hands.

[Pappy13]

Is there a quarterback in the NFL, whom, if inserted into the New England lineup, would make the Patriots not favored against the Dolphins?

Garappolo?

[Tenshot13]

Answer this question for me:

Is there a quarterback in the NFL, whom, if inserted into the New England lineup, would make the Patriots not favored against the Dolphins?  It does make the task much easier for them, though. 

Even with Jimmy G, the Dolphins still have to stop Gronk and that receiving corps. 

 Seriously? Um, almost all of them?  The Pats are a garbage team without Brady.  Get off their tip already.

[masterfins]

So, you can suspend somebody based on "more probable than not"?

Yeah, they can.  Brady should be lucky this is not NASCAR.  Tony Stewart spoke out publicly about safety issues because some teams would only tighten 3 or 4 of the 5 lug nuts during pit stops to try and get an advantage.  So NASCAR fines him $35,000.00, THEN institutes a new rule that all five lug nuts must be tightened.  Figure that out.

[Spider-Dan]

Wait, guys. I still don't understand what this is all about.

Something about a ball that had a hole in it?  It's all very confusing and I don't understand how they can suspend Brady when nobody really even knows what happened.  What about his First Amendment rights?

[dolphins4life]

really you don't know the facts of this case yet after 18 months?

So many sources say so many different things.

[dolphins4life]

I think Amendola and Edelman would be starters on most NFL teams. 

People said the same thing about Welker, but they overlooked the fact that he caught 67 passes as a backup receiver for Miami in 2006.  And this was with Culpepper and Harrington as his quarterbacks.   

Back to the suspension, if it upholds, do you think the Patriots will sign somebody, or will they go with Jimmy G? 

[dolphins4life]

Seriously? Um, almost all of them?  The Pats are a garbage team without Brady.  Get off their tip already.

I don't think they are garbage.  Didn't we conclude this year that quarterbacks don't win or lose football games?

[David Fulcher]

Answer this question for me:

Is there a quarterback in the NFL, whom, if inserted into the New England lineup, would make the Patriots not favored against the Dolphins?  It does make the task much easier for them, though. 

Even with Jimmy G, the Dolphins still have to stop Gronk and that receiving corps. 

...wait--wha'?!?!?!?

I think your a little high from your continual Patriot jock sniffing.  The NE receiving corps, with the exception of Gronkowski, is mediocre.  They would all be #3 receivers on any team without a HOF QB placing the ball in their hands.

Seriously? Um, almost all of them?  The Pats are a garbage team without Brady.  Get off their tip already.

^  These.  Seriously, though, while calling the Patsies garbage and all their receiving corps short of Gronk #3 receivers might be a little bit of a stretch in the other direction, I definitely agree with the sentiment of masterfins and Tenshot on the whole--lifer, I really believe you're just too close (by physical proximity or mentally/emotionally or however you want to perceive it) to the Patsies to discern that they are not such the hot team you think they are.  Yes, Bellicheat is an amazing coach, unfortunately for us, and yes, "Twhammy" Boy is a great QB as much as I hate to begrudgingly admit it (though contrary to "popular belief" a.k.a. BSPN [yes, that was intentional], he sure as hell didn't start off that way, for several seasons, irrespective of SB titles), but that doesn't mean they have an all-around great team at this point.

While I'm also in line with Spider's thinking that our beloved 'Phins will more likely than not find a way to screw the proverbial pooch up there in Gillette on Sept. 18th, to think the Patsies have this great, unstoppable powerhouse of a team without Brady at the helm (or maybe even with...we'll see after Week 5) is a little delusional, IMHO.

*sigh*  I don't post a lot around here, though I view essentially daily, but all these inane postings by lifer regarding the Pats the past year plus have been draining my soul.  Okay.../rant.

[fyo]

According to Vegas, removing Brady from the Patriots is worth about 4 points (in each of the four games). The Patriots were 9.5 point favorites against the Dolphins, now it's closer to 6.

What about his First Amendment rights?

His First Amendment rights to what? Peaceably assemble? Freedom to chose and exercise his religion? Freedom to say whatever he wants?

So many sources say so many different things.

This case isn't very hard to understand.

Being as neutral as I possibly can, this is the gist of it:

1. The balls provided by the Patriots did not have enough pressure and were replaced at half time.

2. The amount of pressure lost could in theory have been natural, but the conditions necessary didn't seem to be present making it likely that the pressure loss was induced from the outside (tampering). Additionally, the pressure loss appeared more variable from ball to ball than one would expect had it been natural (i.e. temperature, ball prep, play etc).

3. Video tape showed a Patriots' employee taking the balls from the refs locker room and into a toilet where he emerged about 90 seconds later. He then delivered the balls to the field. (Neither of these actions is permitted and, apparently, no other team does this).

4. Investigation of the cell phones of various Patriots' employees showed a number of suspect text messages, including references to the employee who took the game balls into  the locker room as "the Deflator". The Patriots subsequently claimed that this wasn't because he was deflating balls, but rather because he want to deflate himself (lose weight). Yes, really. The text messages also contained numerous references to Brady and to pressure of footballs, including threats of increasing the pressure at one point where the employee was apparently pissed at Brady for some reason.

5. Brady destroyed his phone making it impossible to check text messages and phone records. He had been informed of the wish to examine the phone contents prior to the destruction. The offer had also been made to conduct the review via an agreed upon third party who would assure that only relevant records were retrieved and that the phone at no point would need to come into the NFL's (or Wells') possession. Brady subsequently claimed that he regularly destroyed his phones for security reason, despite (at his appeal) producing his two phones prior to that.

6. The Wells' report found it overwhelmingly likely that the balls had been tampered with while in Patriots' possession. Using standard civil case burden of proof, it further found Tom Brady "guilty" of at least knowing about it. These findings were not disputed by any of the judges who heard the case.

7. A judge threw out the 4 game suspension handed down by Goodell, citing a variety of "technical" reasons: There were no prior instances where "just knowing about it" resulted in such a harsh punishment. There was no "advanced notice" that tampering with the footballs could result in such harsh punishment. And, finally, that Brady was unreasonably limited in access to potential witnesses during his appeal.

8. In a 2-1 decision, an appeals court reinstated the punishment, finding that the Goodell did indeed have the authority to impose such a penalty under the CBA and that the federal minimum standards imposed by the Labor Management Relations Act were fulfilled.

The bottom line is that, given all we know, it is overwhelmingly likely that the balls were tampered with by a Patriots employee and that at least some other employees knew about it. Are we supposed to believe that these low-level guys just did this on their own without any input from the quarterback? Really? And when said quarterback then destroys his phone, well, what exactly are we supposed to believe?

[Spider-Dan]

His First Amendment rights to what? Peaceably assemble? Freedom to chose and exercise his religion? Freedom to say whatever he wants?

His First Amendment rights to a trial of his peers and no taxation without representation.

 

[DZA]

Im still a bit confuse about the whole thing,  Why only brady and not the entire organization getting the Hammer.  4 game suspensian and a 1million dollar fine , plus draft picks to me is a slap on the wrist.  Excuse me if im late I been in Afghanistan for the year.

[fyo]

Im still a bit confuse about the whole thing,  Why only brady and not the entire organization getting the Hammer.

The whole organization most certainly did "get the Hammer". Million dollar fine plus their first round pick this year and a fourth next year.

Anytime a team gets docked a first round pick, that's pretty severe punishment.

[Tenshot13]

If it sticks, I'm satisfied with the punishment.