If available, would you trade for Deshaun Watson?

[EDGECRUSHER]

I wouldn't exactly call the #18 and #36 pick plus Tua "the franchise".  That's what I would offer Houston for Watson, take it or leave it.  We can then draft a franchise left tackle to protect Watson at #3 or trade back and recoup some of the picks we gave up to get Watson, and land a home run receiver at the same time.

We also have to factor in that DeShaun has a no trade clause so it won't matter what the Jets offer, he would probably say no. After all, the more they offer the less appealing the team is and they are already pretty unappealing.

Going through a list of contending teams that could use a QB and have draft picks and cap space, I don't know if any exist but us. Your offer of Tua, the 18th and 36th picks might be their best offer that has a chance at happening.

[EDGECRUSHER]

A very short time ago I felt like this would never happen, but now I think there is an over 50% chance Watson is our Week 1 QB. Watson is furious and leaking everything to the media while the Houston ownership is of course stupid and can't do anything right.

The No Trade is really what makes this the most interesting because he wants out but there is no way he is going to accept a trade to a losing team or a team that will gut it's roster and draft capital to acquire him. That really leaves Miami as one of the only true options that would satisfy Watson, Houston and Miami. We can offer them Tua and despite a not so great rookie year, he is still very valuable and will probably turn into at worst a solid NFL QB. Throw in a 1st and 2nd rounder and that should be their best offer and not gut Miami either.

I wouldn't even give them our 3rd pick, give them the 18th and 36th picks. Not like they can go to the Jets or Falcons and get a better offer, Deshaun won't go to those shit teams.

[CF DolFan]

Armando was on with Joe Rose this morning. A few things I found interesting towards this topic.

- Armando said he doesn't see the Dolphins trading for a proven young QB like Watson as it will take 3 firsts and then some more to get him (We traded a LT for 2 firsts, 2 seconds, and player swap). That doesn't fit into what they are trying to do.
- Armando finds it odd that only ESPN is being "leaked" this information. Said typically when info like this is leaked multiple sources will get it
- Joe Rose said to Armando "don't you think it's an agent leaking this stuff to better his client's position" and Armando said "absolutely".
- Joe and Armando also said the timing isn't even right for trade talk as it couldn't take place for two months and most of us would change our minds in that amount of time.
- Lastly when Joe pressed Armando on his article about what "players" are saying and how it blew up Armando responded by saying he was surprised as no one said anything we didn't already know.

[EDGECRUSHER]

Armando was on with Joe Rose this morning. A few things I found interesting towards this topic.

- Armando said he doesn't see the Dolphins trading for a proven young QB like Watson as it will take 3 firsts and then some more to get him (We traded a LT for 2 firsts, 2 seconds, and player swap). That doesn't fit into what they are trying to do.

Well, we would be trading Tua as well so that would count as a high 1st rounder, that just leaves us with a few more picks. However, there are a lot of unique factors with this and the biggest one is his no trade clause. Watson isn't being traded to the team with the best offer, he is being traded to one of the teams he wants to go to with the best offer. We don't have to pay market value.

That being said, the other points he made do make a lot of sense. I don't know what posturing will get him right now though since he already got his money and nothing the new GM can do will make a lick of difference in 2021 since the team has no money or draft picks.  The franchise could always just refuse to trade him and try to make amends but Tua, good draft picks and cap space? That is tempting for a franchise that right now has absolutely no hope.

[CF DolFan]

Well, we would be trading Tua as well so that would count as a high 1st rounder, that just leaves us with a few more picks. However, there are a lot of unique factors with this and the biggest one is his no trade clause. Watson isn't being traded to the team with the best offer, he is being traded to one of the teams he wants to go to with the best offer. We don't have to pay market value.

That being said, the other points he made do make a lot of sense. I don't know what posturing will get him right now though since he already got his money and nothing the new GM can do will make a lick of difference in 2021 since the team has no money or draft picks.  The franchise could always just refuse to trade him and try to make amends but Tua, good draft picks and cap space? That is tempting for a franchise that right now has absolutely no hope.

The Jets are in a much better position to offer. Based on history of bad decisions it also wouldn't surprise if they were to redo his contract as well to make him happier. It definitely seems like we would have to change our whole philosophy of doing things if we were to go after him but I guess anything is possible. If Tua wasn't so accurate I might feel differently. I have to believe they will give him more weapons before they close the door on him. It would really suck to give him away and he has a Drew Brees career meanwhile our mobile QB is hobbled like RG III in year two.

[Spider-Dan]

The Jets are in a much better position to offer. Based on history of bad decisions it also wouldn't surprise if they were to redo his contract as well to make him happier. It definitely seems like we would have to change our whole philosophy of doing things if we were to go after him but I guess anything is possible. If Tua wasn't so accurate I might feel differently. I have to believe they will give him more weapons before they close the door on him. It would really suck to give him away and he has a Drew Brees career meanwhile our mobile QB is hobbled like RG III in year two.

I disagree with a lot of this paragraph.

1) It doesn't matter what the Jets "have to offer" because Watson has a no-trade clause.  The relevant party they would have to work hardest to convince is Watson, not the Texans, and throwing more picks at HOU would not help convince Watson.  I also don't think the Jets even have "more to offer"; Darnold is worthless, and Tua + 3 + 18 (for example) is worth a lot more than 2 + 23 + future picks.

2) What "philosophy of doing things" are you referring to?  MIA's OC just retired, and if there is any hallmark of Flores's time in MIA, it's that he has swapped QBs on a dime with little concern for "philosophy."

3) The RG3 comparison is an interesting one to make.  First of all, RG3 had a FAR better rookie season than Tua.  However, he was ruined by poor decisions from his head coach, who valued winning today over the long-term career of his promising rookie QB.  Sound familiar?

Again, Watson has already proven that he is a HOF-potential QB that we hope Tua might turn out to be.  My concern is that Flores has potentially already ruined Tua, and so if MIA has the opportunity to trade him for a 25-year-old proven superstar QB, I'd rather let HOU figure out whether Tua has been broken beyond repair.  Right now, I feel like Tua is more likely to be on the RG3 career path than Watson.  (Tua is certainly the bigger injury risk.)

[CF DolFan]

I disagree with a lot of this paragraph.

1) It doesn't matter what the Jets "have to offer" because Watson has a no-trade clause.  The relevant party they would have to work hardest to convince is Watson, not the Texans, and throwing more picks at HOU would not help convince Watson.  I also don't think the Jets even have "more to offer"; Darnold is worthless, and Tua + 3 + 18 (for example) is worth a lot more than 2 + 23 + future picks.

Like I said NY is likely to offer him a better contract. They have a ton of money left on the salary cap so they can do it. If NY does that then it helps him to make the move. The Jets own six selections in the top 98 picks of April's Draft: Round 1, Nos. 2 and 23 (via Seattle); Round 2 (No. 34); Round 3, Nos. 66 and No. 87 (via Seattle); and Round 4, No. 98. They also have two #1s in next years draft.  

I disagree with a lot of this paragraph.2) What "philosophy of doing things" are you referring to?  MIA's OC just retired, and if there is any hallmark of Flores's time in MIA, it's that he has swapped QBs on a dime with little concern for "philosophy."

Philosophy is team first, build from within, and not sacrificing picks and trades to get things done. Not sure how swapping QBs to win contradicts any of that.

I disagree with a lot of this paragraph.3) The RG3 comparison is an interesting one to make.  First of all, RG3 had a FAR better rookie season than Tua.  However, he was ruined by poor decisions from his head coach, who valued winning today over the long-term career of his promising rookie QB.  Sound familiar?

He was ruined by running the ball and getting clobbered. I was a big RGIII fan as I like him personally. My dad and I used to debate this often. Unfortunately my dad turned out to be correct.

I disagree with a lot of this paragraph.Again, Watson has already proven that he is a HOF-potential QB that we hope Tua might turn out to be.  My concern is that Flores has potentially already ruined Tua, and so if MIA has the opportunity to trade him for a 25-year-old proven superstar QB, I'd rather let HOU figure out whether Tua has been broken beyond repair.  Right now, I feel like Tua is more likely to be on the RG3 career path than Watson.  (Tua is certainly the bigger injury risk.)

Your concern with Flores ruining Tua is almost laughable because all we do is see Tua cheering from the sideline after getting pulled. Tua was tops on a team that manufactures players who are team first. I don't see anything different in team first philosophies whether it be Alabama, Miami, or New England.  As far as injury tua has learned to go down instead of take the hit. Seems a lot more in line with Brady or Brees to me than RGIII.  

[Spider-Dan]

Like I said NY is likely to offer him a better contract.

Watson just signed the 2nd biggest contract in league history.  I doubt "more money" will convince him to play for the Jets.

Philosophy is team first, build from within, and not sacrificing picks and trades to get things done. Not sure how swapping QBs to win contradicts any of that.

In that case, I'm not sure how signing a free agent to the highest CB contract in the league fits under "build from within," but whatever.

He was ruined by running the ball and getting clobbered. I was a big RGIII fan as I like him personally. My dad and I used to debate this often. Unfortunately my dad turned out to be correct.

Cam Newton and Lamar Jackson won MVPs running the ball, and neither of them were "ruined" by it.  RG3 was ruined because Mike Shanahan kept playing him even when he was clearly already injured, leading to an even worse injury.

Your concern with Flores ruining Tua is almost laughable because all we do is see Tua cheering from the sideline after getting pulled.

We also saw Tua scared to throw the ball downfield for most of the season, and completely unable to do so effectively when he needed to in the final game.  Sure would have been nice to get him some experience being aggressive in comeback situations against DEN or LV, instead of on the road at the #2 seed!

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

All three parties need to agree — Watson, Texans and the receiving team.  If I am the GM of the Texans, I would say to Watson, “if you want a trade, I will get you a trade, but you need to sign a document waiving the no trade clause of the contract and go to what ever team we trade you to, if you don’t sign it, then conversion is over, see you at mandatory OTAs.”

[CF DolFan]

Watson just signed the 2nd biggest contract in league history.  I doubt "more money" will convince him to play for the Jets.
In that case, I'm not sure how signing a free agent to the highest CB contract in the league fits under "build from within," but whatever.
Cam Newton and Lamar Jackson won MVPs running the ball, and neither of them were "ruined" by it.  RG3 was ruined because Mike Shanahan kept playing him even when he was clearly already injured, leading to an even worse injury.
We also saw Tua scared to throw the ball downfield for most of the season, and completely unable to do so effectively when he needed to in the final game.  Sure would have been nice to get him some experience being aggressive in comeback situations against DEN or LV, instead of on the road at the #2 seed!

Most people agree that Tua did not have open receivers. He did better against teams like San Diego and even brought us back against Arizona because he had Parker, Preston Williams, Gesicki, and Jakeem Grant. Not the best but formidable receivers. He didn't have those guys a lot down the stretch and was even playing with practice squad guys. Fitzpatrick is a risk taker and throws to covered receivers. He has a long career of that both working out and becoming Fitztragic. He won one game for us doing that and lost the other which history says is typical for him.  

It seems to me you, as well as other fans, are faulting him for not having anyone to throw to. It reminds me of Tannehill's years where people said how he sucked because he had no running game nor offensive line. Now he has both and is one of the most efficient and best statistical quarterbacks in the league. Funny how those things go together. Kind of like if the great Marino would have had a running game and a defense.

[Spider-Dan]

To be clear, I am not faulting Tua at all.  He is doing what he is told to do, all with the knowledge that if he has a few bad quarters, he will immediately be benched.  None of the other rookie QBs had this kind of sword looming over their head every game.  In fact, I can't think of any other first-round rookie QB ever that's been benched for performance before his first loss.

[Spider-Dan]

All three parties need to agree — Watson, Texans and the receiving team.  If I am the GM of the Texans, I would say to Watson, “if you want a trade, I will get you a trade, but you need to sign a document waiving the no trade clause of the contract and go to what ever team we trade you to, if you don’t sign it, then conversion is over, see you at mandatory OTAs.”

And if I were Watson, I'd say, "OK, see you there.  In the meantime, I will be blasting the owner and front office in the media at every opportunity while collecting the second-highest contract in the league, and every day you wait, your compensation package in the trade will get worse.  You don't even have enough cap room to cut me.  Also, I think my previously-torn ACL is feeling sore.  Be a shame if that got out to the media."

HOU has no leverage here.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

HOU has no leverage here.

Hou has the same leverage as Steelers had with Bell.  If you want to sit home and not collect paychecks that is you choice.  Didn’t work out so well for Bell. 

[EDGECRUSHER]

All three parties need to agree — Watson, Texans and the receiving team.  If I am the GM of the Texans, I would say to Watson, “if you want a trade, I will get you a trade, but you need to sign a document waiving the no trade clause of the contract and go to what ever team we trade you to, if you don’t sign it, then conversion is over, see you at mandatory OTAs.”

Watson would never do that but Houston does have leverage since he is legally under contract. However, Watson does too. No one wants someone trashing ownership on a daily basis and he can sit out a certain number of games and still have it count as a year on his contract. I think the number is 7 but I could be wrong. He wouldn't be getting paid but that is a nightmare for the team and something they want to avoid.

Truth is, no one can offer what we can. We are giving them Tua, a kid who can turn into a great QB and a certain number of draft picks. A trade gives Houston cap space, draft picks and a potential stud QB. This is their best chance at a rebuild, otherwise they just max out at 6-10 with Watson the next 2 years.

[EDGECRUSHER]

Bit off topic but the Seahawks are interviewing Adam Gase to be their new OC. Since they obviously hate Russell Wilson, maybe we can offer them the Watson trade package.