Another murder case going on in Kenosha: Chrystul Kizer

[Spider-Dan]

It's not like if there's a moment where she's not physically chained to a wall, she's somehow choosing to stay.  If you are trafficking a person (and particularly, a CHILD) against their will, you can just tell them "Don't leave this house or I will beat the shit out of you" and that will do a pretty good job of keeping them in place even if you're arrested.

But as requested, here are some more details:

According to Washington Post, those documents show that the police investigation began on Feb. 12, 2018, when a 15-year-old girl called 911 and reported a man had given her drugs and was going to kill her.

Police found the girl wandering in the area near Volar's home wearing only a bra and an unzipped jacket. She appeared to be drugged and told police she had taken LSD.

According to the Washington Post, the police reports state that the 15-year-old told investigators she had met Volar when he responded to an advertisement on the Backpage website about a year before, and that he had been having sex with her since she was 14.

She said she was reluctant to get Volar in trouble, calling him her "friend" but told police he was having sex with other young girls and filming it. She told police the first names of three other underage girls Volar had been having sex with, including the name Chrystul.

That article also covers Volar's arrest:

During that trafficking investigation, Volar was taken into custody on Feb. 22 pending charges of second-degree sexual assault of a child, child enticement-prostitution and use of a computer to facilitate a child sex crime.

His mug shot was taken; he was fingerprinted, and then released pending a summons and complaint as the investigation continued.

He was killed before any charges were filed.

[pondwater]

It's not like if there's a moment where she's not physically chained to a wall, she's somehow choosing to stay.  If you are trafficking a person (and particularly, a CHILD) against their will, you can just tell them "Don't leave this house or I will beat the shit out of you" and that will do a pretty good job of keeping them in place even if you're arrested.

But as requested, here are some more details:

According to Washington Post, those documents show that the police investigation began on Feb. 12, 2018, when a 15-year-old girl called 911 and reported a man had given her drugs and was going to kill her.

Police found the girl wandering in the area near Volar's home wearing only a bra and an unzipped jacket. She appeared to be drugged and told police she had taken LSD.

According to the Washington Post, the police reports state that the 15-year-old told investigators she had met Volar when he responded to an advertisement on the Backpage website about a year before, and that he had been having sex with her since she was 14.

She said she was reluctant to get Volar in trouble, calling him her "friend" but told police he was having sex with other young girls and filming it. She told police the first names of three other underage girls Volar had been having sex with, including the name Chrystul.

That article also covers Volar's arrest:

During that trafficking investigation, Volar was taken into custody on Feb. 22 pending charges of second-degree sexual assault of a child, child enticement-prostitution and use of a computer to facilitate a child sex crime.

His mug shot was taken; he was fingerprinted, and then released pending a summons and complaint as the investigation continued.

He was killed before any charges were filed.

In the 4 months between the time he was released in February and when he was killed in June. Did she go to his house? How did she get there? If so, why? Or did he go kidnap her and chain her to the wall even after being arrested? The exact timeline that happened AFTER he was arrested matters.

[Spider-Dan]

But do those things actually matter?

When considering that this man is accused of trafficking multiple underage girls for sex, is your concern that these children may have had an opportunity to flee and didn't take it?
That if they may have "voluntarily" returned to the adult man who was abusing them, his death is their fault?

What argument are you making, here?  Please lay it out for me.

[pondwater]

But do those things actually matter?

When considering that this man is accused of trafficking multiple underage girls for sex, is your concern that these children may have had an opportunity to flee and didn't take it?
That if they may have "voluntarily" returned to the adult man who was abusing them, his death is their fault?

What argument are you making, here?  Please lay it out for me.

Yes actually those things matter. Here in the United States a person is innocent until proven guilty. She's not allowed to hunt him down, kill him, set him on fire, rob him, joyride in his car, and brag about it on social media. Anyhow, I found the info I was looking for. This is nothing but another of your race baiting threads.

On June 9, detectives interviewed Kizer about the Volar case. Initially she told investigators "she had never been to Kenosha and knew nothing about the (stolen car)." When Kizer was shown a picture of Bolar, she indicated that "he had helped her with money and places to stay."

Kizer later admitted that she was in Kenosha, the complaint says. Kizer explained that "she took an Uber to the (Volar) residence on June 4. When asked whether she was the one who shot Volar, Kizer admitted, "she had gotten upset and she was tired of Mr. Volar touching her." The complaint says, "she pulled the trigger."

When asked about the fire that was set after Volar was shot, the complaint says Kizer stated "she watches the show Criminal Minds and she decided to make a fire."

"Thought to herself, I better cover my tracks," said Greveley

Kizer said she cleaned up after herself and put her dishes in the dishwasher and poured a red liquor everywhere, grabbed tissues and toilet paper and started a fire. She also admitted to leaving the house out of a window rather than the front door.

Prosecutors say she took Volar's BMW, laptop, and some cash.

Certainly if you come to this community from another community and shoot someone twice in the head and then light them on fire, there's going to be severe consequences. Not only do you commit a set of really heinous crimes, you light a body on fire when you're not sure if the person's deceased or not," said Gravely.

So it seems that she voluntarily took an Uber to a different community to visit her alleged abuser, killed him, lit him on fire, robbed him, and bragged about it on social media. 3 days later posting a live video on Facebook where she displayed a handgun and ammo.

Also, if you want to compare this to the Rittenhouse trial. He turned himself in, had a $2 million bail set, and stood trial. Now it's her turn.

[Spider-Dan]

pondwater, you should let some of the QAnon crazies know that all their outrage about child sex trafficking might be unwarranted.  I mean, has anyone asked if these children took an Uber to the people who were trafficking them?

This is exactly what I'm talking about.  Even in the case of a 33-year-old man with allegations of multiple underage girls at his home (and a 15-year-old found outside by the police wearing only a bra and a jacket), when Kizer claims self-defense, it's Volar that gets the presumption of innocence.  But in the case of, say, George Zimmerman, when he claims self-defense, Trayvon Martin is presumed guilty.

No matter the scenario, the interpretation must always be that black lives are inconsequential and they deserve what's coming to them (or, in the case of Rittenhouse, anyone protesting on behalf of black lives).  Today, it's someone defending a 33-year-old man having sex with multiple underage girls and insisting that the child that killed him was the real villain, but I don't even know that that's the worst case we've seen on this board.  I mean, when a black man was sitting peacefully in his apartment and a white police officer shot him dead for no reason, we had someone on this board arguing that if she didn't MEAN to kill him when she intentionally shot him, she shouldn't be convicted of murder.

I must say, though: it's pretty rich for you to accuse me of posting "race baiting threads" after you started the Rittenhouse thread.

[pondwater]

pondwater, you should let some of the QAnon crazies know that all their outrage about child sex trafficking might be unwarranted.  I mean, has anyone asked if these children took an Uber to the people who were trafficking them?

This is exactly what I'm talking about.  Even in the case of a 33-year-old man with allegations of multiple underage girls at his home (and a 15-year-old found outside by the police wearing only a bra and a jacket), when Kizer claims self-defense, it's Volar that gets the presumption of innocence.  But in the case of, say, George Zimmerman, when he claims self-defense, Trayvon Martin is presumed guilty.

No matter the scenario, the interpretation must always be that black lives are inconsequential and they deserve what's coming to them (or, in the case of Rittenhouse, anyone protesting on behalf of black lives).  Today, it's someone defending a 33-year-old man having sex with multiple underage girls and insisting that the child that killed him was the real villain, but I don't even know that that's the worst case we've seen on this board.  I mean, when a black man was sitting peacefully in his apartment and a white police officer shot him dead for no reason, we had someone on this board arguing that if she didn't MEAN to kill him when she intentionally shot him, she shouldn't be convicted of murder.

So you're saying that after he was arrested for allegedly abusing her, that it's ok for her to travel to his house, kill him, set him on fire, and rob him?

Or just maybe an admitted prostitute went back for more money after he was arrested for abusing her and when he wouldn't give it to her, she took it. I don't know about you, but if someone is doing bad shit to me, I don't tend to seek them out, travel to them, and kill them. I want as far away from them as possible.

I must say, though: it's pretty rich for you to accuse me of posting "race baiting threads" after you started the Rittenhouse thread.

My original post about Rittenhouse had no mention of anything racial. Hell, the whole case had nothing to do with race. There were no other races involved except the honkeys. You're totally off base on this one and your racism is on full display for everyone to see. The Aubrey case isn't the Rittenhouse case.

[Spider-Dan]

Children can now be "admitted prostitutes"?  Whatever it takes to arrive at the necessary goalposts!
Again, maybe you should let all those Q whackos know that they can call off the hounds.  Perhaps all the kids in the basement of Comet Ping Pong Pizza took an Uber to get there!

My original post about Rittenhouse had no mention of anything racial. Hell, the whole case had nothing to do with race.

A case about an armed vigilante traveling across state lines to protect property during a BLM protest and subsequently killing two people at said protest does not have "nothing to do with race."

[Phishfan]

This girl trafficed herself based on anything I read so far. She went on a prostitution site admittedly to make money. It doesn't excuse any of his behavior but she admits to being a prostitute by her own account. I haven't read up fully but she took part freely from what I've seen so far.

[pondwater]

Children can now be "admitted prostitutes"?  Whatever it takes to arrive at the necessary goalposts!

According to your own link, "When Kizer was 16, she posted an ad on a website later seized by the FBI as a forum for prostitution."

Again, maybe you should let all those Q whackos know that they can call off the hounds.  Perhaps all the kids in the basement of Comet Ping Pong Pizza took an Uber to get there!

No idea WTF you're talking about.

A case about an armed vigilante traveling across state lines to protect property during a BLM protest and subsequently killing two people at said protest does not have "nothing to do with race."

There fixed it for ya.....

A case about a not too bright white minor, who was found to have broken no laws, while traveling to a place he had as much right to be as anyone else there, that was attacked by 3 white criminals, and subsequently defended himself from being beaten to death-----> has absolutely nothing to do with race.


Again, are you're saying that 4 months after he was arrested for allegedly abusing her. That it's ok for her to travel to his house, kill him, set him on fire, and rob him?  LMFAO...........

[Spider-Dan]

So if I understand the claims on this thread correctly, a child - who does not have the legal ability to consent to sex! - is responsible for her own "prostitution," while the adult man that pays her for sex (and/or otherwise participates in child sex trafficking) is a victim.

She was no angel!

[pondwater]

So if I understand the claims on this thread correctly, a child - who does not have the legal ability to consent to sex! - is responsible for her own "prostitution," while the adult man that pays her for sex (and/or otherwise participates in child sex trafficking) is a victim.

She was no angel!

Neither of them were angels. But are you saying that he deserved to be murdered over a misdemeanor?

Wisconsin - 948.09 Sexual intercourse with a child age 16 or older. Whoever has sexual intercourse with a child who is not the defendant's spouse and who has attained the age of 16 years is guilty of a Class A misdemeanor.

Also, are you saying she isn't responsible for traveling to someone's house, killing them, setting them on fire, and robbing them? You'll also have to reconcile the fact that she admitted to lying, destroying evidence, and trying to cover up her crime. In addition to her social media posts bragging about it. Innocent people don't try to "cover their tracks" because there are no tracks to cover.

You still haven't addressed WHY she went to his house that she subsequently burned to the ground. Self defense also doesn't include stealing a computer, a car, and cash?

[Spider-Dan]

I'm pretty sure raping children is not a "misdemeanor" under Wisconsin law.  Kizer's claim is that that he sexually assaulted her and she killed him in self-defense.

Again, it's amazing how you casually dismiss the actions of someone most people would refer to as a "child predator."  But she was probably asking for it so all bets are off!  I'm sure that you are equally skeptical in other cases of alleged child sex trafficking, with deeply held concerns over why the young girl invited a grown man to come pick them up, right?

But please, tell me more about Joseph Rosenbaum, Wisconsin pedophile, and why he deserved to die.  I guess having sex with kids means you're a scumbag who got what was coming to you if Kyle Rittenhouse is shooting you, but not if it's one of the kids you're paying for sex!

[Phishfan]

So if I understand the claims on this thread correctly, a child - who does not have the legal ability to consent to sex! - is responsible for her own "prostitution," while the adult man that pays her for sex (and/or otherwise participates in child sex trafficking) is a victim.

She was no angel!

A person can be guilty of one thing and a victim of another, it isn't either or.

[pondwater]

I'm pretty sure raping children is not a "misdemeanor" under Wisconsin law.  Kizer's claim is that that he sexually assaulted her and she killed him in self-defense.

I posted the relevant statute, look it up if you wish. As far as I can tell, in Wisconsin, sexual intercourse with a child 16 year or older is a misdemeanor. Furthermore, if I'm not mistaken, in most states the age of consent is 16.

Again, it's amazing how you casually dismiss the actions of someone most people would refer to as a "child predator."  But she was probably asking for it so all bets are off!  I'm sure that you are equally skeptical in other cases of alleged child sex trafficking, with deeply held concerns over why the young girl invited a grown man to come pick them up, right?

He didn't pick her up, she traveled to his home. That is a relevant fact. Quit beating around the bush and fucking tell us all why she went to his house after he had already abused her and been arrested for it? There is absolutely no reason for her to choose to travel to the house of her abuser months later.

If I beat the shit out of you at the bar and you have me arrested. Then 4 months later you travel to my house, kill me, set me on fire, and rob me. What the fuck you think is going to happen?

But please, tell me more about Joseph Rosenbaum, Wisconsin pedophile,

Was Rosenbaum a convicted pedophile? Was Volar a convicted pedophile? I have no idea either way. However, I do know that being convicted of something is not the same as being accused of something. Go ask Rittenhouse, he'll tell ya the difference LMFAO.....

and why he deserved to die. I guess having sex with kids means you're a scumbag who got what was coming to you if Kyle Rittenhouse is shooting you, but not if it's one of the kids you're paying for sex!

No, he deserved to die because he was attacking and assaulting someone and that's what the jury decided. You seem to want to skip the judicial process that Rittenhouse just completed and just set Kizer free without a trial just because she's black. Nope, she can go to trial just like Rittenhouse, McMichael, Chauvin, Guyger, and Zimmerman. Your racism is off the chain, go see a professional for your issues.

[Spider-Dan]

I posted the relevant statute, look it up if you wish. As far as I can tell, in Wisconsin, sexual intercourse with a child 16 year or older is a misdemeanor.

You are talking about consensual sex, which is not what Kizer claimed happened the day she shot Volar.
Non-consensual sexual assault is a felony in every state, no matter the age of the victim.

He didn't pick her up, she traveled to his home. That is a relevant fact. Quit beating around the bush and fucking tell us all why she went to his house after he had already abused her and been arrested for it?

"Why did a supposed victim of domestic violence go back to her boyfriend after she claimed he hit her?"

Do you have the slightest clue how abuse works?

Was Rosenbaum a convicted pedophile? Was Volar a convicted pedophile? I have no idea either way. However, I do know that being convicted of something is not the same as being accused of something.

Rosenbaum was never convicted of assault on Rittenhouse, yet you do not afford him the same presumption of innocence that you give a 33-year-old man with a half-naked drugged teenager outside of his house that alleges he tried to kill her.  The same man, mind you, whose solicitation of underage "prostitutes" you casually dismiss with some sort of both sides made mistakes equivocation.

No, he deserved to die because he was attacking and assaulting someone and that's what the jury decided. You seem to want to skip the judicial process that Rittenhouse just completed and just set Kizer free without a trial just because she's black.

Who is asking that she be set free without a trial?

I mean, it's not like she's George Zimmerman or Travis McMichael, who can freely admit to killing a person and have law enforcement give them a reassuring pat on the shoulder before sending them home (until public outcry forces the police to reluctantly arrest them).  Our justice system DEFINITELY doesn't work that way for black people, so you can put that whole "You think she shouldn't even have been charged!" nonsense out of your mind.  No one on this side is so delusional as to think that a person in Kizer's situation would not have to prove her innocence, even in a case as morally disturbing as this.

And this very thread makes it crystal clear why.