Brittney Griner

[ArtieChokePhin]

And the best way to quit taking your constitutional rights for granted is... to quit speaking out.
Again, I guess liberals don't have to worry about "abusing" our free speech if we're scared to do so, after we "took a good look" at Griner being locked up.

It's incredible that you think YOU'RE the one standing up for the values of this country as you tell other people to shut up and stop criticizing the government.  And naturally, your version of "showing respect for this country" means "liberals should bow down to the police," but NOT "conservatives should avoid hostile takeovers of capitol buildings."

If you think looting businesses and burning homes as a form of protest is ok, but taking over a capitol building to spotlight election fraud isn't, then you clearly have lost your mind.

[Spider-Dan]

When did Griner loot a business or burn a home? I thought your justification for cheering on Russia's conviction of her was that she "trampled on the Constitution and the national anthem," which usually means "she silently kneeled in protest of police brutality." (Reminder: the people opposing this silent kneeling consider themselves the defenders of free speech.)

[ArtieChokePhin]

(Reminder: the people opposing this silent kneeling consider themselves the defenders of free speech.)

Wrong again.   More like the people that oppose silent kneeling are offended because those who kneed are not showing respect for the men and women who fought for the right to free speech/expression.   Including some family members of mine.

[Spider-Dan]

More like the people that oppose silent kneeling are offended because those who kneed are not showing respect for the men and women who fought for the right to free speech/expression.  

They fought for the right to free speech like... silently kneeling in protest of police brutality.  Got it.

Listen, if you want to criticize people for silently and peacefully protesting, that's fine.  I am in favor of you freely expressing your bad and wrong opinion.  But don't give us this BS about how exercising your free speech right to peacefully protest the police is disrespecting the people who died to make sure you have the right to peacefully protest anyone you want (including the police).  YOU are the one disrespecting their sacrifice.

[Dave Gray]

Or that any of that has anything to do with wrongful, politically-driven detention in a foreign country...

[Tenshot13]

She's a giant idiot for bringing any sort of drug to Russia.
The sentence she received was way too harsh.
Both are true.

[EDGECRUSHER]

She's a giant idiot for bringing any sort of drug to Russia.
The sentence she received was way too harsh.
Both are true.

It was too harsh by our standards. By Russian standards, it was actually less than the maximum. No Tolerance drug countries are very serious. I believe in the Phillipines they give you the death penalty for drug use. Always know the laws if you travel to a different country. Hell, know the laws if you travel to a different state. If you are from New Hampshire and want to travel to NYC, leave your gun at home or spend years in prison.

[CF DolFan]

It was too harsh by our standards. By Russian standards, it was actually less than the maximum. No Tolerance drug countries are very serious. I believe in the Phillipines they give you the death penalty for drug use. Always know the laws if you travel to a different country. Hell, know the laws if you travel to a different state. If you are from New Hampshire and want to travel to NYC, leave your gun at home or spend years in prison.

Great points Edge. Many of her supporters come off as entitled and those who act like her protests here warrant the penalty come off as haters but the truth is she is the only one to blame for the situation she is in. We can want change in other countries but they aren't the US of A and it isn't that easy. If other countries were so much better than us like people would have you believe then we wouldn't have so many people literally dying to get in.   

[ArtieChokePhin]

I have to agree with Edge as well.   I may come off as a hater but looking at it without my red colored glasses on, I must say that she did this to herself.  When you go to another country, you are subject to the laws of that country and you are responsible for knowing them.  Ignorance is no excuse.  

I've crossed the border from Texas to Mexico several times.  I've always made sure to leave my gun and my pocket knife in my vehicle before I head to the footbridge because if you are caught with weapons in Mexico, you will be sent to jail for what could be quite a while.

[Dave Gray]

It was too harsh by our standards. By Russian standards, it was actually less than the maximum.

This is factually incorrect.

The maximum possible is 10 years.  She got 9 1/2.

But most citizens would get about 5.
And on top of that, this is a first time offense of someone who is leaving the country.  There is no victim.  She had a small amount.  She wasn't dealing.



She. Is. A. Political. Prisoner.


They're giving her as much as they can BECAUSE she's valuable to the US.   They wouldn't be giving you 9.5 years.

[EDGECRUSHER]

This is factually incorrect.

The maximum possible is 10 years.  She got 9 1/2.

But most citizens would get about 5.
And on top of that, this is a first time offense of someone who is leaving the country.  There is no victim.  She had a small amount.  She wasn't dealing.



She. Is. A. Political. Prisoner.


They're giving her as much as they can BECAUSE she's valuable to the US.   They wouldn't be giving you 9.5 years.

I don't like their law and she probably is getting more time because of who she is, but even at 5 years we would be making a big deal out of it. Fact is, whether we declare it or not, we are at war with Russia and have been trying and succeeding in killing their soldiers for half a year now. We can't reasonably expect Putin to be nice to us and cut us some slack. I would rather her be there for 2 years and the next President comes in and negotiates a reasonable deal for her return as opposed to trading war criminals or arms dealers for her return. It's a shitty situation and there is no neat way out.

[ArtieChokePhin]

I don't like their law and she probably is getting more time because of who she is, but even at 5 years we would be making a big deal out of it. Fact is, whether we declare it or not, we are at war with Russia and have been trying and succeeding in killing their soldiers for half a year now. We can't reasonably expect Putin to be nice to us and cut us some slack. I would rather her be there for 2 years and the next President comes in and negotiates a reasonable deal for her return as opposed to trading war criminals or arms dealers for her return. It's a shitty situation and there is no neat way out.

Reports are coming out that Russian officials are now willing to negotiate a swap of Griner for that arms dealer.   I'm guessing they gave her just below the max sentence in order for them to have some leverage at the bargaining table.

[Dave Gray]

Also, regarding sentencing...

Griner had less than 1 gram on her.

The big sentences are for like...100 grams+.

ALSO......

Griner was arrested on Feb 17.  Putin attacked on Feb 24th.

This was part of his plan.  The tensions there weren't as high yet.  It's not like she entered into a warzone.


Again, she's careless -- no doubt.  But she's being held for political purposes.  She's essentially being kidnapped and they're hiding behind laws to do it, but it isn't fair or just.  She is a pawn.  And that's wrong.

[EDGECRUSHER]

Reports are coming out that Russian officials are now willing to negotiate a swap of Griner for that arms dealer.   I'm guessing they gave her just below the max sentence in order for them to have some leverage at the bargaining table.

Very likely, but are we really going to send over an arms dealer to get back a WNBA player so it looks good for political reasons? Make the swap of equal prisoners or find another way to negotiate.

[Dave Gray]

Very likely, but are we really going to send over an arms dealer to get back a WNBA player so it looks good for political reasons? Make the swap of equal prisoners or find another way to negotiate.

I'm not sure that there will ever be "equal prisoners".  We don't have an equivalent of the merchant of death -- maybe I'm being naive. 

Also, I'm not really comfortable saying that bringing her home is for political reasons, necessarily.  She's literally an American Hero, so it's just kinda important, in general.  But even if she weren't, it's just not a good situation.  That kid who got caught in North Korea stealing a poster and then he was tortured until he's brain dead....  The kid from my childhood that was getting lashings for graffiti, despite being a minor.  These are just, historically, things where you don't want people coming home in a body bag -- for lots of reasons.  Putin is a crazy person and having one of our gold medal athletes being unreasonably detained is not good for anyone -- it hurts diplomacy, increases tensions, ...all kinds of shit.