I am now running on solar.

[fyo]

^ The national average for a solar install is just over 20 grand. Is installation really expensive where your live or is it a huge "full off grid" install?

One of the biggest problem for solar, as I see it, is the insane cost of energy storage if you can't get a good net metering deal where you live. I could get twice as much from my installation if I had batteries.

[Dave Gray]

There is also a 30% tax break that you should factor in.

[Pappy13]

There is also a 30% tax break that you should factor in.

I believe the website claims they factor in all tax breaks, but I could be wrong or the website could be wrong.

[Pappy13]

^ The national average for a solar install is just over 20 grand. Is installation really expensive where your live or is it a huge "full off grid" install?

One of the biggest problem for solar, as I see it, is the insane cost of energy storage if you can't get a good net metering deal where you live. I could get twice as much from my installation if I had batteries.

Hell if I know, but if you check the website it says that it factors everything in so I don't know how they are coming up with those numbers. 20 grand sounds pretty low for a full solar install though. I believe this is not just the panels, but also a storage system. Panels without a storage system is pretty much a waste of money in my opinion.

[Dave Gray]

Pappy, I don't think you know what you're talking about.

Getting a storage system makes no financial sense unless you're living in the wilderness or something and there is no electrical grid.

Solar panels for a full sized home are about 40K.
Then the government credits back about 12K of that.

You may pay more or less depending on how much you need and price variation and stuff, but that's the general idea.

Buying storage doesn't make sense at all.

[Spider-Dan]

There is some value to a storage system.

First is if you live in an area that is subject to power outages, like CA or TX.  I have 1 Tesla Powerwall, which is enough to power my home from sundown to sunup (if skies are clear).

Second is if you live in an area with net metering and time-of-use billing.  For example, electricity is most expensive for me from 3pm-7pm (both in cost and credit).  So during that time, my home runs off my battery, and any energy generated by my solar panels goes back into the grid, running my meter in reverse at the time when I get maximum credits for doing so.  Then in the morning, my home runs off (cheaper rate) grid power until my solar panels charge my battery back to full.  (During events like fire season when outages are more likely, this mode of operation is automatically cancelled and I maintain maximum battery reserve at all times.)

[Dave Gray]

^ This is a weird situation.  I believe my electricity costs the same whenever I use it.

Also, how much is your wall.  The Tesla wall was like $17K when I looked it up.  And it took 2 to run the house.

[Dave Gray]

Pappy, in what State do you live?

[Spider-Dan]

When I bought the Powerwall in 2017, it was $10k installed.  However, CA had a rebate designed to get these kinds of batteries out in service, specifically to reduce the load on the grid during peak times (i.e. exactly how I'm using mine).  So after rebate, it was about $5500 installed.

[fyo]

^ This is a weird situation.  I believe my electricity costs the same whenever I use it.

Also, how much is your wall.  The Tesla wall was like $17K when I looked it up.  And it took 2 to run the house.

That's pricey, but the problem with Powerwalls is that Tesla no longer sells them directly if you aren't also buying panels or solar roof. Their price is aroubd 14k for a single, 22k for two. Everything above that is reseller markup and installation.

When we were spec'ing our system, it just didn't make sense to get storage. We opted for a small installation that basically just takes the top off the electricity bills. It probably reduces our bills by around 30%. If we had storage, we could be close to fully self-sufficient 4 months a year. But that would have tripled the cost of the total install and massively increased the number of years until breakeven. If we had gone with storage, it would have made sense to increase the number of panels as well.

Instead the plan was to buy an electric car and try to optimize charging of that. Our driving needs are easily met by decent BEVs. With many new electric cars now having vehicle-to-grid, that would further increase our flexibility. We haven't quite gotten around to buying the car yet, though.

[Dave Gray]

I have to eat a little bit of crow here and realize that the laws and situations are apparently much different for different parts of the country.

Where I live, in S. Florida, the only reason you would get a battery is so that you would have power in cases where the grid went out, which is basically a hurricane.  At the time I looked, running my home was 1 battery for the house and another just for the A/C.  The cost of the batteries alone for my home was 34K, if I were to get the Tesla ones.  But there were some other kinds that were less.

In general, people who have solar here do not have batteries.  We have 1 to 1 net metering where you feed your power into the grid and use it from the grid at no* cost.



* plus whatever small service fee for using the grid

[Fau Teixeira]

I have 20 panels installed and the whole system ran me about 20k .. it's passed inspection and all I'm waiting for is the electric company to switch out my meter to allow for net metering.

my monthly cost for the panels is $120 / month over 20 years .. i'm estimated to produce 110% of my electricity use .. so in the summer with the AC running it'll be cheaper to pay 120 than it will be to pay $350 / month in electricity costs.

I get savings day 1

[Spider-Dan]

Batteries only improve the CBA if you have time-of-use (TOU) billing.  Without TOU peak/off-peak pricing, there's no financial benefit to time-shifting your grid usage, so the only reason to buy a battery is, as y'all mentioned, to protect against service interruption.

Note that in most areas, if you do not have a battery and the grid goes out midday, you cannot run your home off of solar panels, as this would present a danger to any utility workers trying to restore the grid.

[Fau Teixeira]

Note that in most areas, if you do not have a battery and the grid goes out midday, you cannot run your home off of solar panels, as this would present a danger to any utility workers trying to restore the grid.

That is correct here in CT. if the power goes out your solar panels are a fancy roof decoration until it comes back on

[fyo]

Batteries only improve the CBA if you have time-of-use (TOU) billing.  Without TOU peak/off-peak pricing, there's no financial benefit to time-shifting your grid usage, so the only reason to buy a battery is, as y'all mentioned, to protect against service interruption.

Unless you live in an area without net metering (or bad net metering). Then batteries allow you to store the daytime production when you're not at home anyway and use it in the evenings/mornings when your usage spikes, but production is lower.